Eyeglasses

[soilman]

OK, my local optician wants 330 to fill my opthamologist's prescription for glasses with progressive lenses. Looking around the internet, I've found a number of companies which offer what appears to be equivalent or better glasses, at less then $200, in some cases, less than $100. Anyone have any experiences, good-bad, with getting prescriptions for eyeglasses filled, over the internet?

I really hate it when new lenses come with a scratch, no matter how tiny. I look them over with a magnifying glass. Drug-store glasses almost always have scratches, from people handling them.

Anyway, since I am going to have a job that involves data entry from small print on pieces of paper, and also walking around the office and finding things, unless I have progressive lenses I am going to have to change glasses, which will slow me down. Especially for reading from the paper and entering into the computer screen, I will need 2 lenses, as the lenses that are strong enough for me to see the writing on the piece of paper, won't work on the computer screen unless I put my face way too close to it. Then if I get up to walk around, I will need a third set of lenses, although I can probably manage not to bump into things, I won't be able to read signs and labels while walking around unless I have progressive lenses or trifocals.

Most of the web eyeglass merchants ask for your prescription information in distance vision, and "add for near vision." My opthamolgist used the distance vision and near vision numbers. So I need to figure out how to convert the near vision spec to the "add" spec.

[VagabondPoet]

I've worked as an optical tech for a few years now and I strongly advise sticking with a reputable optical for filling your prescription.

When ordering from the web, there is no way of insuring that the seg measurement on progressives (where the prescription needs to be in the lens in relation to the pupil) is going to be appropriate, nor will you get the glasses with the proper pantoscopic tilt on the frame...which is essential for proper fit in progressives.

Also there is the frame issue. Unless you know your eye size and temple length on your current frame, getting a similar fit will be difficult.

Check into JC Penny Optical, Sears Optical, WalMart, or Sam's Club opticals in your area. JC Penny especially runs some great deals when it comes to packages on frames and lenses, even into progressives, usually topping at about $189. Just because you got your prescription with your doctor, it's no reason that it cannot be filled by another provider.

If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

[soilman]

It now seems to me we're talking $90 for web glasses, $330 for local optiician. I've looked up pantoscopic tilt and seg measurements but haven't figured out what they are yet. However I have a nice collection of small grasping tools that I can use to bend metal frames. I always do this after buying drugstore reading glasses for $20. When buying glasses on the net they ask for your pupil distance, which I can measure myself to within a millimeter or 2. However I do think that lens height on my nose may be an issue since they simply ask "how high on your nose do your wear your glasses, low, medium, or high" or something like that, and although I could adjust the lenses up and down, the height where I see well, might not be the height were the glasses look well on me, onless the height is adjusted and taken into account, before the lenses are fitted.

Although my opthamologist prescribed +2.50 diopters lenses for both eyes, for reading, I know that I can't see small print that I used to be able to see (like on printed street maps, and telephone books, and ingredient lists on food labels, or markings on electronic components such as integrated circuits, with the +2.75 diopter glasses I have. I need a magnifying glass in addition to the +2.75 diopter glasses. However I know to see very small print with more powerful glasses on my face, I will have to hold the reading material abnormally close to my face. Holding it at a normal distance, 2.50 or 2.75 is about right. Point is tho, if I buy over the net, I can write my own prescription. Local optician won't fill a prescription I write myself.

[Skylark]

Are you asking for money, Soilman?

[soilman]

No I'm not asking for money. Where would you get such an idea. I'm simply trying to avoid having to shell out $330 for glasses, if I can get good enough glasses for $90 instead. This is the frugal forum, is it not? It takes me only 3 days to net $90 (gross income minus transportation expens to-from worksite). I'd have to work 11 days to earn $330. Plus, if I have to go to an optician, I would have to take a day off from work (and not get paid for that day).

[Skylark]

I wasn't sure, so I asked.

[soilman]

Also, if I'm not working in a competitive envirnoment, drugstore glasses for $20 a pair, and $60 for 3 pair (one for distance vision, one for computer screen, one for paper on desk), would do me just fine. I'd simply change glasses back and forth, when switching from reading somethings, to checking that I'd typed it in correctly, on the computer screen. But if I am doing data entry in a competive office, I can't expect to compete if I have to switch glasses every minute, like that.

[Blobbenstein]

I get my glasses(long sighted) from http://www.spex4less.com/#

though I dont know if they deliver abroad.

I get the cheap ones for about £20($40) and they're pretty good.

I dont need bifocals, if I want to read ingredients then I just have to take my glasses off.

[Joe]

Anyway, since I am going to have a job that involves data entry from small print on pieces of paper, and also walking around the office and finding things, unless I have progressive lenses I am going to have to change glasses, which will slow me down. Especially for reading from the paper and entering into the computer screen, I will need 2 lenses, as the lenses that are strong enough for me to see the writing on the piece of paper, won't work on the computer screen unless I put my face way too close to it. Then if I get up to walk around, I will need a third set of lenses, although I can probably manage not to bump into things, I won't be able to read signs and labels while walking around unless I have progressive lenses or trifocals.


I am wondering whether it would not be more cost effective to have some sort of magnifying glass--perhaps one that fits on a stand--and use that to read the fine print on the pieces of paper. I haven't gone around trying to price such items, but I don't imagine they'd be as expensive as glasses.

Here's one listed on Amazon for $10:

http://www.amazon.com/GROBET-FILE-CO-AMERICA-INC/dp/B000HTVUFS

There are links to others from there.

For the computer screen, aren't there magnifiers built in to Windows or otherwise readily available for free?

I just don't see why you are trying to do it all with glasses.

[soilman]

Joe such devices would not enable me to be competitive at a data entry tasks which require rapid reading and typing in of what I read, of tiny bits of text and numerals extending all over a 8.5 inch by 11 inch, or larger, page, for display on screen extending across a modern 17-inch or 19-inch computer monitor with 1280 x 1024 pixels.

With both devices, for larger size characters, you pay for it by reduced field of vision. With reduced field of vision, you have to read a bit, stop reading and move somethng, or scroll along, then read a bit more, instead of being able to read continuously by simply moving your eyes or your head. It is more time consuming, and a handicap in the competitve field of data entry.

I know 2 legally blind people who purchased special programs to read text on a computer screen. They spend lots of time looking for their place on the page, and then scrolling along reading 3 characters at a time. They also use their very expensive, very large illuminated magnifyers on stands. It takes them time to find their place on a page, and more time to move the sheet of paper underneath it, to read the next few letters. They use these devices in addition to their eyeglasses. If they have a few words to type, they may do it themselves. The emails that they send me contain fummy errprs that apparently result from their not really seeing what it is they typed. If they have a whole project that needs typing or entry, they get a secretary to do it.

[Joe]

Perhaps you can ask your local Lions' Club to lend you the money for the glasses, and then you can pay them back.

[soilman]

VagabondPoet writes
When ordering from the web, there is no way of insuring that the seg measurement on progressives (where the prescription needs to be in the lens in relation to the pupil) is going to be appropriate, nor will you get the glasses with the proper pantoscopic tilt on the frame...which is essential for proper fit in progressives.

Also there is the frame issue. Unless you know your eye size and temple length on your current frame, getting a similar fit will be difficult.

Is the seg measurement the same as the pupillary distance? Is it the 2 distances, one from center of nose to Left pupil and one from from center of nose to Right pupil? I googled this and pantascopic tilt, but had lots of trouble understanding what I read. And if I have metal frames, can't I easily adjust the pantascopic tilt if I have a big selection of small needle-nose pliers in my toolbox, including one with conical tips (an arc falls on the thing being held, instead of a flat surface falling on the flat surface; thus it makes a fairly large arc as a bend, instead of a sharp-line bend; this weakens the flat strip being bent, less). I also have bending tools designed to bend wires in piano actions, to adjust the piano actions. They are a basically a piece of metal with a slot in it, with a screwdriver-handle on the other end. You place the wire that you want to bend, into the slot, then to bend the wire, you just rotate the handle. I have years of experience making very fine adjustments to piano actions.

I found a web page that explains how to put the optical center of the lens the right distance below the pupil, according to what degree of pantascopic tilt there is. Not sure yet how to find the op center of the lens.

[VagabondPoet]

A pd measurement is very different from a seg height. The seg height has to do with the distance between the center of the pupil (for progressives) and the bottom of the lens. For bifocals the measurement is from the lash line, and for trifocals it's from the bottom of the pupil. Ordering from an online provider is hit and miss when it comes to this because a) you will not know how the frame you have selected will sit on your face without having tried it on b) without having the frame for reference, getting the proper measurements is nearly impossible. The difference of a mere few millimeters is enough to make a pair of glasses unwearable, especially when dealing with progressives.

[soilman]

Thanks for all the information Vagabond Poet.

Well, I must tell you, my local optician, who my opthamologist recommended so highly, filled my bifocal script incorrectly. The MD wrote +.50 add +2.5 and added that separate computer glasses should be +1.75. I ought to remark that the eye doctor's handwriting was awful; but it is the optician's job to make sure they understand what the MD intended, before going ahead and trying to do it.

The optician made my bifocals, which we very clearly discussed, were to be for use with the computer screen when looking up and to read from pieces of paper when looking down, +1.5 add 1.5 (+1.5 for looking at the computer and +3.0 diopters for looking at the piece of paper.)

By the way, both the eye doc and the optician insisted that the NV (near vision) spec on the script meant the same as add that amount, for near vision, and was not the actual diopter amount for near vision.

Anyway, I questioned the optician about the prescription and they phoned the eye doc, and he said that indeed, the glasses should be +1.75 add 1.25 (1.75 diopters for looking at the computer and 3.00 diopters for looking at the piece of paper). So now i have to to back there 2 more times, 10 hours total of public transportation. Once to drop off the frames, and once to pick them up with the new lenses. They take several hours to put the lenses in the new frames. Unless I want to wait around 4 hours, I have to come back another day.

OK. The on-line co asks "how do you wear your glasses - higher up on my nose (most common), all the way up on my nose (almost touching your forehead), or lower down on my nose (middle of my nose)" I suppose I would answer "higher up" as I don't wear them quite all the way up as is possible. I let them drop down about 1 mm. However I can bend the metal wires that hold the nose rest, and thus move the lens up and down about a mm or so in either direction. Plus I almost always do adjust the pantscopic tilt - since my I have a protruding brow and deep set eyes, and if I don't adjust the tilt the top part of the lens picks up oils from my forehead. This web site (http://www.quantumoptical.com/onlinecourses/disantom/thn/slide1.asp?courses=28)seems helpfull for adjusting the pantoscopic tilt.

[soilman]

Vagabond Poet
When ordering from the web, there is no way of insuring that the seg measurement on progressives (where the prescription needs to be in the lens in relation to the pupil) is going to be appropriate, nor will you get the glasses with the proper pantoscopic tilt on the frame...which is essential for proper fit in progressives

I'm having trouble now using the bifocals I got from the local optician. Aside from the fact that the computer part (top part) is not quite strong enough, because the optician filled the script incorrectly, I'm having a worse problem: when I look at at the computer, the bottom part of the computer screen is obliterated by the blurry area of the bottom part of the glasses. When I look at a piece of desktop paper, I can't see the whole page at once (like I can with single-focal-length glasses), and I have to move my head up and down to read a page. I thus tend to lose my place on the page, since I can no longer keep landmarks on the page, to return to, within my field of vision. Also, since I have to move my head into weird positions to see, I'm getting a crink in my neck from keeping my head in those positions. I'm concerned this is going to trigger one of my notorious migraines. It seems quite apparent to me that it is much more less work, less stress, and more comfortable, to move your eyes than to move your head.

Is there any advantage of progressive lenses, over trifocals, as to how well I am able to see at various distances? Or will I be able to see just as well with trifocals? I don't care if people see a line. What I am concerned about is how well I am able to see, and how much or how little effort I have to put into seeing well - such as avoiding changes glasses, and avoiding moving my head, and being able to move my eyes to find things.

[lachry]

My last two pairs of glasses I got online, from Glasses Direct UK (I paid about 15 pounds - [32 dollars]?).

http://www.glassesdirect.co.uk/release_000/index.htm

Now, I tend not to wear glasses too often these days. I once was scurrying for my glasses even before getting out of bed, wearing them all day for everything. But now I try to avoid wearing glasses. As such, it is not neccessary for me to have anything but a 'functional' pair. Hence that's what I have.

If it's possible, get a dirt cheap pair of glasses online to see what you think. I haven't had any problems - but different country, different company, different situation.

[soilman]

Lachry do you have single focal-length lenses, on the one hand, or do you have bifocals, trifocals, or progressive lenses, on the other. As VagabondPoet indicated, there is a difficulty fitting multifocal lenses in frames, so that they line up with your eyes properly, that doesn't exist in regard to single-focus lenses.

[IamJen]

I too, was going to suggest the Lion's Club. I'm only really familiar with their work in MI, where I grew up, but they do a bang-up job with spectacles there.

I've ordered my contacts (pre-packaged) from online sites with good luck, but I would be very hesitant about ordering glasses.

[Skylark]

I too, was going to suggest the Lion's Club. I'm only really familiar with their work in MI, where I grew up, but they do a bang-up job with spectacles there.

One of the chapters of the Lions' Club in my area gave a magnification machine to the library in that town. It enlarges print so people who are legally blind or close to it can still read. I thought it was a wonderful gift, especially given the large percentage of that town who are seniors with financial constraints.

Soilman, have you checked with your local chapter? Even if they have a policy against lending people money for glasses, they may be able to point you to additional resources. Can't hurt. They're not going to charge you for asking questions.

[soilman]

So if I'm having trouble using bifocals - my eyes hurt and I get a headache, and I get lost on the paper-page and lost on the computer screen due to the reduced size of the field of vision, and the intrusion of an area of blurryness makes me dizzy and nauseous, and if I get pain in my neck and fatigue, trying to see things by moving my head and holding my head in an uncomfortable and ultimately painful position in order to see - am I going to have even more trouble using progressives? Or are they going to make my life easier?