I do some work for a company that deals with these industries, so I'll snoop around (I once found some Dairy Industry internal publication about making "milk safe to drink by 2000").

Ooh, thank you! If you are a bit worried about posting it publicly just PM me... I'm preparing myself for private debates on another board because I made statements about the dairy industry... I told them I wouldn't debate it on the board (it would be TOO offtopic) but would respond to PMs... and it's always handy to have such information at hand just in case... :) I found a couple of articles already, but that would be even better. :D

I would be interested in viewing this Data as well. May be enlightening!

Does anyone have any excellent sources (preferably non PETA or obvious vegan ones) about veal and the dairy industry in Australia? I'm going to go googling now but thought ya'll might have some must have links...

hi shewolf :hi:

there is the website of animals australia, they are more of a protection/welfare group rather than a vegan one (from what i can tell).

here is the link to their website >>>

animals australia (http://www.animalsaustralia.org/)

check out their fact sheets. they cover alot of issues. here (http://www.animalsaustralia.org/facts/dairycows.htm) is the link about dairy cows.

" Animals Australia is the Australian arm of the Australian and New Zealand Federation of Animal Societies Inc. (ANZFAS). It was founded in 1980 by Professor Peter Singer (author of 'Animal Liberation') and Christine Townend (founder of the first Animal Liberation group in Australia). It is the umbrella organization for around 40 animal protection groups in Australian and New Zealand. Those groups gather in a capital city annually and an elected 20-member Executive manage business."

i hope that was what you were looking for!
ohhh and you could also check out the video from the qld veg*n society called "truth or dairy" (even though it is american and not australian) :)

Thanks WOE! I found the animals australia site... also the humane society has a few articles about veal calves.

It has to be Australia, if I had information about America these people would just point out that America is not Australia... which is valid.

I have learnt more than I ever wanted to about veal calves though...

Thanks WOE! I found the animals australia site... also the humane society has a few articles about veal calves.

It has to be Australia, if I had information about America these people would just point out that America is not Australia... which is valid.

I have learnt more than I ever wanted to about veal calves though...

good! i hope you found what you were looking for!

the veal calves innocent faces are in my mind all the time when i see chocolate or ice cream or milk or cheese ..... makes me wanna :cry: and then :spew:

I had someone say to me "dairy isn't bad, it's veal production practices that are bad"... right, keep deluding yourself... grrr.

I had someone say to me "dairy isn't bad, it's veal production practices that are bad"... right, keep deluding yourself... grrr.


geee, what planet are they from? oh wait, that would be earth! :rolleyes: :grr:

geee, what planet are they from? oh wait, that would be earth! :rolleyes: :grr:

She's a middle-aged omni who selectively adores some animals and eats others... the other thing she said was "If I eat cheese, then I'm guilty by association?" Well YEEESSSSSS..... she has no time for extreme radicals like me LOL.

Hi all

New here and still finding my way about the place. - seems a great place BTW- A lot of the information about food and products/online shops etc is USA or UK. Does anyone have some good links for decent vegan food in Brisbane? Been reading a lot about Tofurkey and it seems everyone loves it, is this availiable in Aust? Any other decent meat substitutes around?

I have a fairly large circle of family and friends and stay away for weekends a lot. Generally I have to take something that can be easily cooked so it's not a hassle to everyone else when they sit down to their bbq's. I like soy sausages and vegie patties but get sick of them! Just wondering if anyone knows of anything availiable online maybe a bit more exotic for a change?

(I am lazy, and don't like cooking very much - prefer premade stuff, but I am getting a bit better lately and have made some rad curries veg style!)

Descentia

Hi all

New here and still finding my way about the place. - seems a great place BTW- A lot of the information about food and products/online shops etc is USA or UK. Does anyone have some good links for decent vegan food in Brisbane? Been reading a lot about Tofurkey and it seems everyone loves it, is this availiable in Aust? Any other decent meat substitutes around?

I have a fairly large circle of family and friends and stay away for weekends a lot. Generally I have to take something that can be easily cooked so it's not a hassle to everyone else when they sit down to their bbq's. I like soy sausages and vegie patties but get sick of them! Just wondering if anyone knows of anything availiable online maybe a bit more exotic for a change?

(I am lazy, and don't like cooking very much - prefer premade stuff, but I am getting a bit better lately and have made some rad curries veg style!)

Descentia

hi descentia! firstly welcome to VB :hi:

there are a few people from brisbane here at VB. i am from brisbane but right now i am OS.

anyway, i recommend checking out vegano (http://www.vegano.com.au). they are an online vegan shop based in nimbin (nsw) i believe. i've never shopped from them but they seem to have a wide range of products.

i would also recommend checking out the vegan society of qld (http://cwpp.slq.qld.gov.au/vvsq/default.asp) website as they have recipes and shopping info and also a forum with helpful people (like me and shewolf ;)) hehehe
here is a link (http://cwpp.slq.qld.gov.au/vvsq/products.asp) to their supermarket shopping guide!

i'm sure the others can give you more detailed info about products. :)

i also made a small vegan guide (http://www.rootsofcompassion.org/beta/zine/guides/guides_main.shtml) to brisbane which you can check out if you like. it's actually about restaurants so maybe you know about them already :)

anyway, good luck :up:

I kept meaning to reply to Descentia's post... oops...

the other good online store is http://www.crueltyfreeshop.com.au I shop there on a semi regular basis and I recommend them.

For bulk foods and less common foods Mrs Flannery's is great...

Coles usually has a decent health food section with tofu etc.

As far as restaurants go, I've only eaten at Squirrels and Veg Out in the Valley. Veg Out had a real funky laid back atmosphere, but as an ovo-vegetarian it was a little difficult as a lot of their meals contain dairy. There are some vegan meals though, and the food was good.

Squirrels, well I got takeaway, the restaurant itself seems nice and ambient, but the second time I got food I was unimpressed. I was overcharged (I was charged the dining in price) and the food was quite bad. I may give them another chance but I'd eat in rather than getting takeaway as the food may be better (and I can send it back if it's as badly prepared as last time).

Also, Kurm posted this a couple of pages back

http://www.vnv.org.au/Products/MeatAlternatives.htm

Thank You!!!!

Excellent links. As I recently moved back to Brisbane after living in Toowoomba for Uni (meat eating capital of QLD!), I have been out of touch and am going to try all the restaurants on your vegan guide with_open_eyes.

I am currently following up all the other links.

i'm glad we could be of service to you :)

I'm really hating this ****ing country.

its better than a lot of others.

^^ She’s got a point. ^^

True.

I'm really hating this ****ing country.

Why exactly now???

You should make an easy-reference list Kurm :D

recent bad experience i guess?

Actually, I should have said the Australian government (and the alternative isn't much better).

^^ i agree he's got a point this time ^^

Here is some information on the kangaroo issue from Pat O'Brien, President of Wildlife Protection Assn. of Australia Inc. (http://www.wildlifeprotectaust.org.au/)
Coordinator, National Kangaroo Protection Coalition and the Wildlife Division Representative, Animals Australia.

Red Kanga populations down in SA too!

Drought has driven the state's red kangaroo population to a 25-year low and forced processors to look interstate for meat supplies. The price of kangaroo meat is expected to rise next year following a decline of 37 per cent over last year's population - the lowest since the annual aerial survey began in 1978. Australia's largest processor, Athol Park-based Macro Meats, has started buying meat from Queensland and New South Wales because of the local shortage. The decline also means commercial quotas for next year's kangaroo harvest have been cut by 25 per cent. Environment Department kangaroo management ecologist Lisa Farroway said the state's population had fallen to about 1.8 million from a peak of up to three million. "The biggest impact on kangaroo populations is rainfall over the previous 18 months," she said. During drought conditions, kangaroos stopped breeding and could lose young joeys, while more adults were likely to die. Red kangaroo numbers had fallen by 33 per cent over the past 12 months, following a 10 per cent decline last year. This rose to 37 per cent when the newly surveyed Marla-Oodnadatta region, north of Coober Pedy, was included. The pastoral zone population was now the lowest recorded since 1978. Meanwhile, western grey kangaroo numbers had decreased by 19 per cent. The Central Flinders and Goyder region recorded a decline of 50 per cent since last year. The harvest quota for this year had been 480,700 but the expected total is less than 210,000. Next year's proposed quota is 361,300. Macro Meats managing director Rita Borda said numbers also had declined in NSW and Queensland but six weeks ago she began buying meat from harvesters there. "It is going to be an extremely difficult year next year and this year was bad enough," she said. She said prices were likely to rise next year as the cost of sourcing meat increased. *Adelaide Advertiser. *Ed. Comment. No wonder they wan tto open up the Southeast corner to commercial shooting. Let's hope they all go broke next year, or even sooner!

Trophy Hunting.

The new Northern Territory Croc Management Plan just released for public discussion will provide for trophy hunting of crocodiles. Can you imagine what animal they will want to trophy hunt next? Yes, the poor old kangaroos will be next! More about this proposal soon

Arguments to use to shoot down Industry Propaganda.

Of the 50 or so species of macropods, six are extinct and 29 are threatened or in much reduced ranges. From this abysmal record we should not be complacent about any species. This article provides some arguments to use to argue against the kangaroo Industry.

* The pastoral lobby has claimed ownership of the 'kangaroo problem' through the absurd claim that there have never before been so many kangaroos as now because they have provided them with water.
* One wonders why this myth is sustained when we can apparently take thousands of gigalitres of water out of the Murray-Darling system for people and produce, but apparently before pastoralism, kangaroos could not get a drink.
* We have five major rivers flowing inland through Queensland to the Lake Eyre basin and a huge grassland now supporting millions of cattle and sheep but kangaroos apparently had nothing to eat and drink until Europeans came along and settled the country!
* Amazingly we have been so clever as to create pasture for 100 million sheep and 10 million+ cattle (on Gordon Grigg's figures, the equivalent metabolic mass of 400 million kangaroos) but 20-50 million kangaroos would have starved in the past!
* In regards to the increase in kangaroo populations over the last twenty years the Environment Australia (EA) national graph is presumably quite misleading since the counting technology and the correction factors have changed over this period, especially in the last 5 years!
* You would certainly not get a straight answer from EA as to whether they have adjusted the historical figures to account for this, especially as they are dependent on the States!
* An EA figure showing a massive increase from 1998 but going down in 2002 and no doubt way down in 2003, compares with a figure from SA which shows the highest populations in 1981 for reds, and not in recent years. In SA 2003, Red kangaroo populations have dropped by 25% and the industry is looking to other states for enough kangaroos to process!
* In the NSW 2004 kangaroo counting figures that have been corrected, it has three years of positive trends for reds (1997, 1998, 2001 ranging from 9-40%) and four years of negative trends (1999, 2000, 2002 and 2003 ranging from -7% down to -53%!).
* So we start with 5.3 million reds in 1997 and end with 2.2 million in 2003 which farmers and governments claim is a population 'out of control!!!!!
* Due to changes in counting technology, it is invalid to compare pre-2001 counting with post-2001.

The full report which this info came from, sinks the whole idea of a spectacular increase and shows what a fraud it is.

Well done WOE!