What do you think of horse racing?
Vote here: http://msnbc.msn.com/id/12916472/
So far, 33% say it's cruelty to animals.
62% say it's a worthy sport despite the tragedies that occur. :furious:

I just posted about this in another thread.

It's interesting that if you look at odds of a horse being injured, it's just as likely to happen in a paddock when the horse is turned out with other horses, as in the course of training/racing.
They are just very delicate animals (certain breeds especially).

I'm not sure where I stand on racing, as I've met many horses who love it. I've met good people who love horses in the racing industry.

And I'm sad to say some AR people who are anti-racing have turned me off by saying things like I'm cruel because I keep animals as pets who should be running wild.

I'm going to upset all the AR people by saying that I firmly believe it is possible for humans and non-humans to live together in mutually beneficial relationships. So I don't believe that every situation in which humans and non-humans interact on an institutional basis is inherently bad for the non-human party. But I don't know enough about horses and horse racing to know if it's so riddled with circumstances that are bad for horses that it just ought to be done away with, or whether it can be a good thing for everyone when good people are involved.

But there was no "I don't know" vote.

Well I DO know something about horses and racing. Here is the thing. In of itself, horse racing is not inherintly evil. I have known horses to break legs just out playing in the field. Think of the physiology of it, 1000 or more pounds on 4 splindly delicate legs, that stand on a very delicate bone in the hoof. WOW seriously I am in awe that horses are as athletic as they are.

but with that aside I think there are some current problems
1. The genepool is getting to inbred, breeders breed to winners over and over, there isnt enough natural variety and the horse is less substantial than it was.
2. Racing waaaayyy to young for profit. The horse should be at least 4 or hopefully 5 before it is raced

To me it's not so much the fact that they get injured, as people have pointed out horses break their legs just running about in the field, it's the fact that whether they are treated, or just killed depends on how profitable they are, how many races they have won, ect.

I don't agree with people riding or keeping horses in general, but if people should have to have horse companions they should respect and look after them, not base their worth on how successful they are at something, and don't even get me started on the people who send their horses to slaughter or (at best) a shelter if they don't win enough races.

I think 'humane' and 'industry' are mutually exclusive when it comes to non-humans. "Pets" are supposed to be the paradigm case of a respectful relationship with non-humans and you know what the pet industry is like.

Maybe in some distant future where society's fundamental attitude towards other species isn't to determine their value in terms of human needs or desires, I will reconsider my position. Until then..

I think 'humane' and 'industry' are mutually exclusive when it comes to non-humans. "Pets" are supposed to be the paradigm case of a respectful relationship with non-humans and you know what the pet industry is like.
Yeah, I think you've hit the nail right on the head there... anytime profit is involved, that's a pretty clear sign that non-humans are being treated solely as a means and not as an end unto themselves.

The problem is not that people race horses, it is what happens after their careers are over. If all horses that raced were retired and adopted out if not wanted afterwards, it is fine. The problem is the people who look at them as a widget and just dispose of them after their careers are done. I always said there should be a test where if you can't afford or won't keep a horse after they are done racing, you shouldn't be able to race one.

Say what you want about Greyhound racing. In CT, there is a track Shoreline Star which made a policy of any greyhound that got hurt racing, they would pay the vet bills to treat/fix the injury and ensured that any dog done racing was adopted out. During the time they operated (this year there is no live racing), not one dog was put to sleep because they could not find a new owner. Also, the national board has a policy that indicates there will be 100% adoption by 2007. This is something horse racing (including harness racing) should be adopting.

I've never been/watched horse racing as a sport. I did have a pony as a kid in which I learned she liked the food I gave her but seemed to prefer to make up her own mind on when to come and go.

I posted this on another thread somewhere: http://www.supershorts.org.uk/view.html?id=512 I'm posting it here too because it's a) a really cool thing to see and b) it seems to me the wild horses in the video link above are more lively and happy as opposed to the horses in servitude to humans. I'd imagine that race horses would really rather not train day in and out, be forced to run when perhaps they don't feel good and overall would prefer a more peaceful existence as opposed to all the stress that would go along with racing.

I voted cruelty on the poll, not surprising there were many more folks who voted that cruelty was acceptable.

I've heard on a Dateline-like show many years ago of people trying to fix races by inserting sponges into horses' noses so they can't get full amount of oxygen.

Horse racing is cruelity!

I think a lot of the racing world (and showing world too) is full of cruelty, and people training too hard too early. I'm not completely sure where I stand on it. I don't think all people who are in the racing/showing world are evil...I'm just not attracted to the 'industry' in general. I love horses--horseback riding not as much--I think horses can be great as companions, and if I were to have horses, I'd probably ride them only infrequently--and bareback or something. Anyway. The horse world is a huge place. There are people in there who are cruel or who are ignorant, I'm just not of the experience to put a thumb on any of it.

I've heard on a Dateline-like show many years ago of people trying to fix races by inserting sponges into horses' noses so they can't get full amount of oxygen.

Horse racing is cruelity!

That is a practice banned at every racetrack.
It is not reflective of all, or even most, trainers.

You are damning the entire profession because of the evil of a few.

BTW, if a horse doesn't want to race, do you honestly think a puny human can force them to?
Racehorses who make careers of it love what they do.

BTW, if a horse doesn't want to race, do you honestly think a puny human can force them to?"If an elephant doesn't want to perform in the circus, do you think a puny human can force them to?"

"If an elephant doesn't want to perform in the circus, do you think a puny human can force them to?"

Very different activities. The sustained concentration & heart of a racehorse are not imparted by force & abuse, but by cultivating the animal's intrinsic love of racing with others of her/his kind.
Beating an elephant until it stands up is a very different matter.
Horses that don't have the passion don't make money.
It's a waste of everyone's time to try to race a trotter who repeatedly breaks stride or sulks, so such horses are usually used for breeding if they have a great pedigree.
I'm very against what happens to some of the not-so-well-bred horses who don't cut it on the track, but killing horses is not inseparable from racing as some would say it is.
The Standardbred industry is really getting into placement of unsuccessful/retired trotters & pacers, & the main trade magazine has a huge feature on it this month.