League of Humane Voters of New York City's E-News & Action Alerts, 5.2.06
For more information, call (212) 889-0303 or visit http://www.humanenyc.org

On Friday, a young horse broke away from the carriage he was being forced to pull, galloping into Central Park and breaking the hip of a 71-year-old man named Lawrence McKittrick.

We don’t know this horse’s name but we have heard that he’s okay, all things considered. This incident comes just months after a similar accident left Spotty the horse dead on the streets of Manhattan and three people injured.

In a statement released earlier today by the Coalition to Ban Horse-Drawn Carriages, of which LOHV-NYC is a member, John Phillips explained that “Central Park is filled with bicyclists, runners, children and pedestrians, in addition to cars and taxis—it’s no place for horse carriages. The City Council and the Mayor should not wait for another accident before they address this issue.”

It’s also worth noting that Council Member Tony Avella’s recent misguided effort to help the horses, Intro. 44, would not have prevented an incident such as this; it would simply restrict horse-drawn carriages to Central Park while they were working. Intro. 44 would not alter or amend the existing horse carriage law regarding the temperature (or humidity) at which the horses are permitted to perform nor would it address the grossly inadequate shelter that they live in.

Meanwhile, lest we forget, the horse-drawn carriage industry is paying the lobbying firm Connelly and McLaughlin $2,000 a month, according to the New York Press, to ban pedicabs from Midtown because of alleged safety concerns. Happily, they appear to be failing. The second hearing on Intro. 75, a bill which we support that would regulate pedicabs, is scheduled for May 11th.

Please call your Council Member and urge them to sponsor legislation which would ban horse-drawn carriages in New York City. For more information or to find out who your Council Member is, visit http://www.humanenyc.org or call us at (212) 889-0303.

Individual horses are treated like metal machines like cars and an example of this is when people refer to the inside of cars as something something horse power.

I went to NYC recently, and I was very upset at the way the horses were treated. They didn't have access to water, and looked hot and sweaty.
I saw a man harshly tug his horse when it tried to put it's head down. It already had lots of scars.
Stupid people actually support the drivers by getting a ride.

I don't think the horsepower reference is an illustration of people thinking of horses as machines...it is a unit of measure that naturally evolved since whe went from horses to engines as our means of transportation.

however, a lot of working horses aren't treated well, and it's a shame. I train and ride horses and give riding lessons and the #1 thing people don't seem to get is that the horse is not a robot. he's not programmed to listen to you. he has good days and bad days just like you do, so we as good stewards of horses need to learn how to work with them and adapt to how they are feeling. contrary to popular (AR) belief, well-cared-for horses can really take to their tasks and enjoy work, especially that which is mentally stimulating, like dressage. but it's a partnership, and both parties need to be equally invested, emotionally and physically.

if I can't instill this in my students, I refuse to teach them any more. :no:

You mean you physically dominate individual horses,just try to do that to a free living horse and your'll be trampled.

You mean you physically dominate individual horses,just try to do that to a free living horse and your'll be trampled.
Tell us how many horses you have been around.

I don't need to be "around" horses which must be your eumphemism for dominating them.

I think you are wrong, but each to their own.
Please try and play nicely kids...

boo oooo

I feel horrible for city horses.
They all look so beaten and tired.....

listen snownose,as the largest fleet owner in the horse & carriage industry. I really wish you would stand behind what you say.Get the hoof # from the horse's hoof along with the carriage license plate,and make a formal complaint,including your name and address,so that leaves the operator and owner to file a legal action if its unfounded!

please tell me what you see thats so bad.These horses aer licensed,and registereed with the DOH,there are NO Beaten carriage horses,please! They wouldn't look this healthy,and be doing the increasing amount of business that we do every month,every yr.We are applying for 50 more medallions to be issued befor the holiday season just to help cover the amount of rides that are waiting in line,to ride.Christmas time,there is at least a 2hr wait,just to do a 20 minute ride.

I mean emotionally beaten, not physically.
Every one I've ever seen....their eyes look dead.

please tell me what you see thats so bad.These horses aer licensed,and registereed with the DOH,there are NO Beaten carriage horses,please! They wouldn't look this healthy,and be doing the increasing amount of business that we do every month,every yr.We are applying for 50 more medallions to be issued befor the holiday season just to help cover the amount of rides that are waiting in line,to ride.Christmas time,there is at least a 2hr wait,just to do a 20 minute ride.I am not really familiar with the horse carriage industry (I am in Australia) however I have grown up around horses and been riding since I was four and this sounds like a very cruel industry. It sounds as though the horses are used for hours at a time (perhaps most of the day?). And on busy streets with cars all around? Sounds awful! Horses are majestic creatures and do not deserve this. I cant even imagine what they must be thinking at Christmas time-screaming kids, bags of shopping, decorations aargghh how horrible. And what a horrible ending for Spotty to have had! It can be argued as to the cruelty of horseriding but there can be no arguing that it is MUCH crueler to have horses working all day long in awful surroundings. At least riding horses are only worked an hour or so a day, usually not everday (approx obviously varies) and ridden in paddocks and arenas which are much more pleasant/ peaceful. Riding horses dont have to do the same thing day in day out. Plus when riding you can build up a partenership with the horse. So dont pretend to care about the horses...you obviously only care about making money

I am not really familiar with the horse carriage industry (I am in Australia) however I have grown up around horses and been riding since I was four and this sounds like a very cruel industry. It sounds as though the horses are used for hours at a time (perhaps most of the day?). And on busy streets with cars all around? Sounds awful! Horses are majestic creatures and do not deserve this. I cant even imagine what they must be thinking at Christmas time-screaming kids, bags of shopping, decorations aargghh how horrible. And what a horrible ending for Spotty to have had! It can be argued as to the cruelty of horseriding but there can be no arguing that it is MUCH crueler to have horses working all day long in awful surroundings. At least riding horses are only worked an hour or so a day, usually not everday (approx obviously varies) and ridden in paddocks and arenas which are much more pleasant/ peaceful. Riding horses dont have to do the same thing day in day out. Plus when riding you can build up a partenership with the horse. So dont pretend to care about the horses...you obviously only care about making money

Exactly. Unfortunately I didn't get the carriage number, and I'm not in Ny anymore. The horse did not look like a carriage horse, more like a riding horse. It was skinny and full of scars.

Horses have numbers on their hooves, horsechick? Is this number on a particular hoof, or will a concerned person have to inspect each hoof of a given horse to find the number?

Snownose,hasn't a clue,on the facts of the carriage horses.We are fully licensed and insured,of couse horses have acess to water,there are 2 water tubs with running water provided by the parks d ept,and every carriage has a pail and wrench to open a hydrant if needed.If he visited in the Summer ,of course he'll see sweaty horses,this is nature cooling their bodies off,people sweat in Summer too.If you don't approve of our industry,which is increasing more carriages this yr,due to demand,you have a full right to not approve,but don't make up ridiculous lies,especially ones you cannot prove.

Snownose,hasn't a clue,on the facts of the carriage horses.We are fully licensed and insured,of couse horses have acess to water,there are 2 water tubs with running water provided by the parks d ept,and every carriage has a pail and wrench to open a hydrant if needed.If he visited in the Summer ,of course he'll see sweaty horses,this is nature cooling their bodies off,people sweat in Summer too.If you don't approve of our industry,which is increasing more carriages this yr,due to demand,you have a full right to not approve,but don't make up ridiculous lies,especially ones you cannot prove.


I meant no ACCESS to water, not no water. What does the water help when the horses aren't allowed to drink it? They just stand on the curb waiting for more customers. Of course no one would miss a potential customer just to give the horse some water.
Oh, and I visited in the middle of winter, and it was freezing.
I'm not making up lies, I am simply stating what I saw and my opinions about it. The fact that you are getting so defensive about it makes me wonder...

It sounds as though the horses are used for hours at a time (perhaps most of the day?). And on busy streets with cars all around? Sounds awful! Horses are majestic creatures and do not deserve this. I cant even imagine what they must be thinking at Christmas time-screaming kids, bags of shopping, decorations aargghh how horrible. So dont pretend to care about the horses...you obviously only care about making money

Exactly. Have you seen New York city during the busy season? Its hectic and noisy. The poor horses must be so bewildered.

Snownose,hasn't a clue,on the facts of the carriage horses.We are fully licensed and insured,of couse horses have acess to water,there are 2 water tubs with running water provided by the parks d ept,and every carriage has a pail and wrench to open a hydrant if needed.If he visited in the Summer ,of course he'll see sweaty horses,this is nature cooling their bodies off,people sweat in Summer too.If you don't approve of our industry,which is increasing more carriages this yr,due to demand,you have a full right to not approve,but don't make up ridiculous lies,especially ones you cannot prove.

Hello horsechick. Now that you have returned, I was wondering if you would answer my question about which horse's hoof usually contains the serial number you mentioned.

http://www.satyamag.com/aug94/jordan.html
http://www.equineadvocates.com/carriage.html

Today they must work long hours in all weather, battle traffic, breathe exhaust fumes from motorized vehicles, and in general are not even adequately watered (not so many pools of urine!"), and some receive inadequate or poor feed and insufficient veterinary care.

Yet sometimes a horse is forced to pull a 9-passenger carriage, plus the driver and possibly someone on the seat beside him. In addition, as Holly Cheever, D.V.M. points out, 'Lameness and hoof deterioration are inevitable when a horse spends its life walking or jogging on the unnaturally concussive asphalt of city streets.'

Some horses are worked with split hooves and some have internal parasites. Deaths of horses in New York City have been a disgrace. One year, three horses died the same day, followed by a fourth shortly afterwards. Lame ones and blinds ones have been found working there.
...

Drivers love to get between the shafts and 'prove' that the carriages are not heavy. It would be interesting to see the condition of these clowns after pulling a carriage loaded with passengers all day long, in the broiling sun, without shade, proper rest or sufficient water.

Furthermore, an honest carriage driver will tell you that the problem is not so much the weight of the carriage, as the effort the horse has to make when it starts up again after a stop.

Considering the number of starts and stops it makes on a busy street, this effort is constant. So are the exhaust fumes, so is the pounding on the pavement. And so, many times, is the heat or the cold

...and in the end there are no green pastures for carriage horses -- only the slaughterhouse.

I read a really good, factual article a year or so ago about how overworked these animals are, but can't find it now...

One can always inject a little realism into people's selfish holiday activities by pointing out how ridiculous it is that they can't be bothered to walk their own lazy asses down the street and instead have to force a horse to do it for them. Participating in animal abuse should not be a fun activisty.

The hoof # is on the front left hoof,manadtory by the NY Health Dept.Snownose,you seem very worried about me being money oriented,maybe,this is more tha fact you are obviously making up these outragous lies,caues money is involved,and we make a fantastic income by it.As for you saying the drivers won't give their horses water,thats hte best 1 i have heard yet! There are 2 water tubs at each end of the ride,plus we carry water in our buckets and a wrench to opena hydrant,this really sounds like a animal rights extremist,who believes what they want to believe,rather than the facts.

do you honestly believe horsechick that it is not cruel the way these horses are overworked in terribly unnatural conditions? surely you can at least acknowledge that the horses dislike it and it is cruel? Put yourself in their "shoes".

For all the talk about horse carriage operators being licensed, I'd like to point out that trappers and slaughterhouse operators also must be properly licensed. Dog owners have to license their dogs, no matter how they behave toward their pets. Simply being "licensed" doesn't assure whether something is humane or not.

Secondly, the horse carriage operator's main argument seems to be that horse carriages are popular. Well, as I'm sure the people on this website are well aware, an activity's popularity also has nothing to do with whether it is ethical. The vast majority of people eat meat. Does that mean there are no valid criticisms of factory farms and slaughterhouses? America certainly loves gas-powered cars. Does that mean there are no ethical problems in the oil industry?

Let's keep the focus on the horses and their well-being, where it belongs, rather than these tiresome lines which seem to come from the mouths of every industry and business on the planet when they are being criticized.

NY really isn't any place for a horse. I've grown up around horses and they need space to graze, room to roam. They are NOT ment to pull carriags. Once in a while is fine, my neighbors horses are occassionaly hooked up to a wagon, or sled, and a couple of people will go for a ride. But they're working horses, and there's two hooked up to the wagon and theres never many people on. Plus they can drink whenever they like, and if they want to rest, they rest. The reins aren't even held, they're usually sitting on the seat, the horses just follow the trail at their own pace. And this only happens 2 or 3 times a year.