Their annual walk-a-thons are upon us. The Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine (PCRM) has an easy way to order yard signs and pamphlets to use to actively protest their unrelenting use of many animals in experimentation on behalf of neo-natal human health. My problem is I know more people need to realize the horrors of vivisection, but pamphletting walkers in the March of Dimes ceremonies - is it worth it? The huge societal conditioning of doing 'anything' for the health of babies can unlikely be changed by in-person discussion of us vs those who believe in the MoD strong enough to be out there walking. Should we not allow them their freedom to express their mis-guided but universally approved 'for babies' walk? Would not we entrench their 'hate' of us animal lovers even more by being there at their time of expression? Thanks for any helping thoughts.:think:

You need to pick your battles wisely. Public protests of March of Dime walk-a-thons makes the animal rights movement look anti-human and uncompassionate. They don't see us protesting against the mistreatment of animals, they see us protesting against research that saves countless human lives. To most people human lives are just as important if not more important than animals. Most of the people at these walk-a-thons have been closely affected the loss of a newborn or dealt with the difficulties of birth defects and diseases--waving signs at these people is coldhearted and tells them you don't care what they've gone through. There are better ways to protest vivisection.

I agree 100% This is one of the rare cases where I don't think protesting is a good idea. There can't be nothing worse then losing a child.NOTHING good can come from waving signs. Yard signs & handing out pamphlets to someone who lost a child............. Just a bad idea!

My advise is to skip the protest's & write higher up's include those pamphlets and ask to find better ways to research & test.

Thanks guys. You have settled it for me. I agree with both your good thoughts and will spend energy in other, more-productive directions. Regards.

I third that.
I've read about the research the MoD does and I'm all for finding less cruel ways of doing it, however, my twins were extremely premature and it was the research done by the MoD that saved their lives.
I feel a hypocrite either way on the issue but there are much less cruel ways of protesting then handing out pamphlets to parents or loved ones of babies who were born sick and small and telling them the organization that, no doubt, is responsible for saving or trying to save their child/loved ones life is worthless.
I don't think you'll convert anyone there honestly.
Mary

Animal experimentation has'nt saved any lives only taken them,Maryc you believe the drug industry trained doctors too much,and their on the pay roll media pals.

There has and continue's to be thousands of honest scientists,doctors who oppose vivisection on medical grounds,but there ignored by the media and thus ignored by you.

Slaughter of the innocent and Naked empress or the great medical fraud by medical historian Hans Ruesch explains all.

How do you think these babies get sick in the first place?
Their mothers give birth in hospital,previously given chemical filled drugs,vaccines all cultured on animal body parts and fraudulently passed as "safe" through vivisection.

Animal experimentation has'nt saved any lives only taken them,Maryc you believe the drug industry trained doctors too much,and their on the pay roll media pals.

Um, yeah. I'll believe the word of those who actually, ya know, develop treatments and such. You know, those Nobel Prize winners who credit research involiving animals with their results. Thanks though.


There has and continue's to be thousands of honest scientists,doctors who oppose vivisection on medical grounds,but there ignored by the media and thus ignored by you.

Thousands? Maybe.
How many more don't oppose vivesection. But they are all dishonest, right? :lol:


Slaughter of the innocent and Naked empress or the great medical fraud by medical historian Hans Ruesch explains all.

I love it when people base opinions on the writings and interpretations of one person. It's funny.

How do you think these babies get sick in the first place?
Depends on what they are sick from.

Their mothers give birth in hospital,previously given chemical filled drugs,vaccines all cultured on animal body parts and fraudulently passed as "safe" through vivisection.

Um, yeah. Can you cite a credible source that gives your reasons as the number one cause of birth defects?
Thanks. Keep us posted.

To most people human lives are just as important if not more important than animals.That doesn't necessitate condoning vivisection though.

But yeah, even though facing these kind of issues seems inevitable, as long as there are other things to protest, I would choose them over this.

Sevenseas: "as long as there are other things to protest, I would choose them over this."

:yes: I do protest MOD with my money. I do not support them with donations or anything else. But I would never be the slap in the face to a mother who is grieving for a lost child.

I see you are pro animal experimentation Tame,who gives the nobel prizes out in the field of "medicine" the same medical people who are trained in the vivisectionist mentality in university and who profit(research grant money)from doing vivisection.
I don't base my opinions of one person Tame,these books that i previously mentioned contain the opinions and statements of numerous medical people and scientists who condemn the "research" method of vivisection for passing dangerous drugs,vaccines,chemicals as "safe".

What does "treatments mean Tame? Chemo and radiation is called a "treatment" but causes hideous adverse effects including cancer and kills the patient quicker than the cancer does.(as documented in a long study by Prof Hardin Jones,cancer people who took the drugs,chemo,radiation,surgery lived for 3 and a half years,cancer victims that did'nt lived for 12 and a half and surley suffered alot less)

I've cited credible souces which are contained in these books including nobel prize winners-Slaughter of the innocent and Naked empress or the great medical fraud.

I'll name a few:Dr Robert Mendelsohn,Dr Vernon Coleman,Prof and Researcher Pietro Croce, Dr Ray Greek and many more.

Every one needs a god,and todays god are the white coated "researchers".

I've leafletted an MoD walk before. I would not hold signs or be rude in any way. Only smile and offer information. I actually admire the participants for taking the initiative to try to do something to help others. I just think they might reconsider the types of research and organizations they choose to support toward those ends. I didn't have any unpleasant interactions with people, personally.

That said, I think a campaign with leaflets/letter writing/media advertising leading up to the annual walks would probably be much more effective than leafletting let alone demonstrating at an actual walk, and I won't be doing the latter again.

By the way birth defects in babies have been going up and up every decade,i wonder why is that? it does'nt just happen like a bolt of lightening,there's a cause and effect,and who passes the useless drugs,vaccine,chemicals,artificial sweetners,oil that cause diseases,deformities,blindness and death,the "researchers".

Oh and by the way the same "researchers" you are appraising Tame,conducted with the help of the national institutes of health grant money, experiments on babies who were obtained from finland,and were decapitated and killed by a "researcher" who justified it saying "its saving lives"(documented, in naked empress or the great medical fraud-book)

Will anyone hear promote the decapitation and killing of a baby to hypotheticly save future babies? i would'nt,but Tame would

I see you are pro animal experimentation Tame,who gives the nobel prizes out in the field of "medicine" the same medical people who are trained in the vivisectionist mentality in university and who profit(research grant money)from doing vivisection.
I don't base my opinions of one person Tame,these books that i previously mentioned contain the opinions and statements of numerous medical people and scientists who condemn the "research" method of vivisection for passing dangerous drugs,vaccines,chemicals as "safe".

You base your opinions on ahandful of people who engage in the intellectual equivalent of inbreeding. Based on what I have seen from some of these nutters on various websites, I know that they are a distinct minority, and are pretty good at quoting others out of context.


What does "treatments mean Tame? Chemo and radiation is called a "treatment" but causes hideous adverse effects including cancer and kills the patient quicker than the cancer does.(as documented in a long study by Prof Hardin Jones,cancer people who took the drugs,chemo,radiation,surgery lived for 3 and a half years,cancer victims that did'nt lived for 12 and a half and surley suffered alot less)

Odd. I know cancer patients who used chemo or radiation, are in complete remission, and have been for over 10 years.
I could also point out that without reading Hardin's "study", my first question would be if he was comparing cancer patients from similar groups with similar prognoses.
Obviously, other studies have disagreed.


I've cited credible souces which are contained in these books including nobel prize winners-Slaughter of the innocent and Naked empress or the great medical fraud.

Other Nobel Prize winners disagree. In fact, more than agree with your position. Also, by using Nobel Prize winner as a positive criteria of those sources validates my use in an earlier post, making your statement above...worthless.

Every one needs a god,and todays god are the white coated "researchers".

I prefer David Hasselhoff.

I'm sure the drug industry and chemical industry will hire you Tame.

By the way birth defects in babies have been going up and up every decade,i wonder why is that?

1.) Source?
2.) easy answer: effective diagnosis, rapid transfer of information, higher rate of previously non-viable pregnancies reaching birth.
Rather simple.

it does'nt just happen like a bolt of lightening,there's a cause and effect,and who passes the useless drugs,vaccine,chemicals,artificial sweetners,oil that cause diseases,deformities,blindness and death,the "researchers".

:lol:

OT but I decided if I get cancer I will forego chemo or radiation and let it run its course.

Oh and by the way the same "researchers" you are appraising Tame,conducted with the help of the national institutes of health grant money, experiments on babies who were obtained from finland,and were decapitated and killed by a "researcher" who justified it saying "its saving lives"(documented, in naked empress or the great medical fraud-book)

And you verified this accusation how?
And you actually believe that researchers were decapitating live infants, against all medical ethics, and then reporting the results? :lol:


Will anyone hear promote the decapitation and killing of a baby to hypotheticly save future babies? i would'nt,but Tame would

:lol:
Again.
:lol:

I'll add that to the list of funniest things people have said about me here.

<<<Infant decapitator...but only by proxy.
(I think everyone will agree you have now lost this argument.)

I'm sure the drug industry and chemical industry will hire you Tame.

What are they paying? Good benefits?

Why don't you look at those books ive mentioned,oh wait here's another one written by the same medical historian Hans Ruesch-1000 doctors against vivisection and many more.

Chemo kills every good and bad cell in the body and ruin the immune system(the only health preserving entity),and radiation cause's consequentual cancer's,similarly the medical establishment have expanded the definition of cancer,people will gentle lesions have been told they had cancer,survived the chemo,drugs,radiation and then told they have been cured,a women who survived this torture in england sued the hospital who put her through hell and pain ,then told her it was'nt cancer,with her life ruined.
Cancer has been overcome through nutritional means which helps the immune system to self heal all over the world but that is inexpensive and cheap unlike chemo,surgery,drugs.

Volunteer for chemo Tame,you will soon be hairless,sterile and immune ruined

I have known people to have survived cancer through traditional and non-traditional methods. Sometimes one method doesn't work and sometimes it does. It really depends on the person.

Yes the baby decapitation is documented in Naked empress or the great medical fraud and was covered by some tabloid newspapers.

The medical establisment have no ethics,they serve themselves and cause widespread disease and death,and then, make up intellectual names for disease's they cause.

Experiments on human beings have been done in prisons,mental institutions,orphanages,president clinton was forced to apologize after several black men were experimented on and injected with syphilis a while back.

Why don't you look at those books ive mentioned

Because I have active, functioning brain cells?

,oh wait here's another one written by the same medical historian Hans Ruesch-1000 doctors against vivisection and many more.

The same guy?
On the same subject?
With the same opinions?
No way!


Chemo kills every good and bad cell in the body

Um...every?
It would certainly help matters if you didn't discuss what you don't understand.


and ruin the immune system(the only health preserving entity),and radiation cause's consequentual cancer's,similarly the medical establishment have expanded the definition of cancer,people will gentle lesions have been told they had cancer,survived the chemo,drugs,radiation and then told they have been cured

Um see above. I suggest you start by looking at survival rates for things like luekemia, which is certainly not a misdiagnosed lesion. Please compare those rates to 30 years ago.
Thanks.

Cancer has been overcome through nutritional means which helps the immune system to self heal all over the world but that is inexpensive and cheap unlike chemo,surgery,drugs.

Prehaps the cancer was nothing more than a lesion? Can't both sides play that game?


Volunteer for chemo Tame,you will soon be hairless,sterile and immune ruined

<<Knows patients who have had chemo, and then had children.
<<Knows chemo patients who have grown hair back.
<<Not allowed to volunteer for anything since a horrible incident involving pain killers and vodka.

Vegania = Hans or significant other?