After arguing incessantly about whether vegans are better people (i say they are), I fired this psychologist. He also liked diminishing my achievements because I am "narcissistic". Truth is, I feel better w/o him in my life.
I'm still isolated & mentally ill, but at least I'm not paying someone to say vegans are ethically identical to meaters, & tell me that I really haven't achieved anything special in life & I'm no better than anyone else.
I feel I've achieved a lot in going from hospitalized & living on disability & attemping suicide/self-mutilating, to self-supporting, working ft in high stress industry in the public eye, & living a much more normal life.

have you considered looking for a different psychologist? I looked for recomendations after I stopped seeing one of mine who was the most horrid therapist I've ever seen.

I'm in school to become a therapist. There are good ones and bad ones. And sometimes you just don't fit. Try one or 2 sessions with a new therapist and find someone who fits you better. (Not necessarily someone who tells you what you want to hear). Good luck!

I'm in school to become a therapist. There are good ones and bad ones. And sometimes you just don't fit. Try one or 2 sessions with a new therapist and find someone who fits you better. (Not necessarily someone who tells you what you want to hear). Good luck!


I completely agree.

It sounds like your psychologist doesn't have high ethical standards for himself. He doesn't have the right to impose his own values or put down your own. I hope you can find another therapist :)

I think it was within your rights to fire your psychologist.

There is a doctrine of "autonomy" that ethical psychologists/psychiatrists respect. It seems like your psychologist did not respect this doctrine. I had the opposite problem when I was in treatment with a psychiatrist--if I'd ask him for advice, he'd refuse to give it to me, saying that it would violate my "autonomy." I think this was B.S. on his part. I needed help. I asked him for help. He refused to give me help. I never asked him for "autonomy." He pulled this out of his butt, as far as I was concerned. He never discussed this with me nor got my consent to this. He just "pulled" this on me when I asked him for advice.

I think you had the opposite problem. Your psychologist had zero respect for your autonomy. That is not good, either.

I don't know what the answer is. I don't know how to find the appropriate balance.

Ultimately, the success of your treatment is up to you. Hire and fire as you think fit. If you are not getting what you want out of treatment, then get out of treatment.

It's an odd expression "I fired a psychologist". As if you were his employer.

Would be nice if you could find a vegetarian psychologist. There must be one somewhere.

I think you made a good move in leaving this doctor. You may very well be narcissistic for all I know, but I don't see how denigrating the choices and accomplishments you are proud of would make you less narcissistic. You have every right to take pride in the life-choices you make. I think it's one thing for a therapist to help a narcissistic patient to recognize how self-centered behaviors hurt her relationships with others and prevent healthy functioning in the world, but it's another to put the patient down in an attempt to "humble" her. It sounds to me like you felt your doctor was doing the latter.

I agree with others that you should shop around until you feel that you've found a doctor who is respectful of your beliefs while he or she is still honest with you about areas you need to work on.

It's an odd expression "I fired a psychologist". As if you were his employer.

Would be nice if you could find a vegetarian psychologist. There must be one somewhere.
That would be kinda cool, but honestly why should it matter why your psych. eats? I don't see the point of bringing up veg*nsm up in therapy. Sort of a non-issue isn't it?

I have a non-veg psychologist, as well as a non-veg consulting dietician, and both of these relationships work very well.

That would be kinda cool, but honestly why should it matter why your psych. eats? I don't see the point of bringing up veg*nsm up in therapy. Sort of a non-issue isn't it?

It seems to have been an issue for Organica. And it's her therapy.

It seems to have been an issue for Organica. And it's her therapy.
True, but I'm just wondering why that would be of importance. I would think the most important thing in a therapist is the ability to help deal with mental issues. And since veganism is not a mental problem I don't know why it would be an issue...but hey, whatever makes someone feel comfortable.

if I were to go to a shrink ever again, I would mention, in passing, the attitude I get from my mom from my change to veganism. My mom's been a hassle to deal with! I buy my own foods, I eat some veggies, she buys fruits and veggies, i cook my own food, etc. I am doing the searching out, the inquiries, etc, but constantly get belittled by comments such as "well, *smack lips noise in disgust* I don't know *where* to go to sit down and eat a vegetarian meal" (note the complete defiance to the fact that I do not eat fish/seafood/dairy/eggs)...
"mom, I can order something that's not on the menu, worst case scenario is a salad and/or fruit and vegan sushi. it will be fine, i promise."

but she stews on it, and then gets disgusted when I request assistance of the server, as though she's got some responsibility to it. If I drove us there, it's my own responsibility to ensure I'm getting food that I am able to eat and happy with...not hers...but
regardless

the point here is, if I had a psychologist, I'd be pointing out these every day happenings, because it means that my choice in food intake is putting pressure on daily relationships, and that may make some aspects of my life difficult to put up with.

Hope this gets my drift out there..I'm not the OP, so I have no idea what her reasonings are behind telling her psych., but it seems logical that in order to portray all healthy relationships and unhealthy relationships, the psych. needs to know what may/may not cause strains in such relationships in order to get to a baseline.

^_^
goodluck finding a new shrink. As with any doctor, you should feel comfortable with whatever doctor you are seeing.

Thanks everyone.
I think I am going to go without a psychologist actually, & see how things go.
The more I think about the things the fired psych. was saying to me, the more I know he was out of line.
I just got a sponsor at Al-Anon, so I think talking to her may be more effective than having my "narcissism" attacked & everything I've achieved/stand for being trivialized.

I think it's one thing for a therapist to help a narcissistic patient to recognize how self-centered behaviors hurt her relationships with others and prevent healthy functioning in the world, but it's another to put the patient down in an attempt to "humble" her

Totally. There is no such thing as emotional growth apart from love and acceptance. Seems your therapist missed dealing with his or her own issues before trying to help with yours. And I think your choice is a good one. Recovery groups know what they're doing a lot more than some mental-health professionals.

After arguing incessantly about whether vegans are better people (i say they are), I fired this psychologist. He also liked diminishing my achievements because I am "narcissistic". Truth is, I feel better w/o him in my life.
I'm still isolated & mentally ill, but at least I'm not paying someone to say vegans are ethically identical to meaters, & tell me that I really haven't achieved anything special in life & I'm no better than anyone else.
I feel I've achieved a lot in going from hospitalized & living on disability & attemping suicide/self-mutilating, to self-supporting, working ft in high stress industry in the public eye, & living a much more normal life.


Wait a minute - your first complaint is that your therapist won't tell you that you're superior to other people? What therapist would? Then we read your history in the second paragraph above, and in your followup post you say you feel that you don't need therapy!

I'm mentally ill. I've been on mental disability myself, and now I'm working, and it is still a struggle, but no matter how "well" I ever feel I wouldn't stop regular therapy.

I'm not trying to dishearten you, but you're not being realistic about your own stability. So far as your therapist goes - if you're not happy with the one you fired, that's ok. Get another one. Finding a good therapist is a lot like dating. It usually takes a while to find a good match.

Finding a good therapist is a lot like dating. It usually takes a while to find a good match.
That's a great analogy. :)

Therapists can be very helpful, but it's your life and your choice. Since you feel your relationship with your therapist was unhealthy, maybe consider seeing another one, but take a little time off first, like with dating.

Wait a minute - your first complaint is that your therapist won't tell you that you're superior to other people? What therapist would?

She didn't say he wouldn't tell her she's superior. She said he belittled everything she did and everything she believed in. There's a difference.

Well, Morna, we only read Organica's side of the story, not the therapist. I have no idea what the intentions of the therapist where, but for all I know they might have been very good, and Organica misinterpreted whatever he said to her for being belittling. Or not, we just can't know.

Organica, I have very little advise for you, I'm not a therapist. But I hope you aren't 'scared away'from therapy because of a bad experience with one therapist. I hope you can find another which suits you better.

Let me make a suggestion. The psychologist who coined the term "superiority complex" was Alfred Adler. My suggestion is that you read up on his thoughts before you get involved with another psychologist/psychiatrist. His leading book on the subject is called Superiority and Social Interest.

Adler says we all strive for superiority. He does not claim, as your psychologist apparently did (absurdly), that there is no such thing as superiority, that non-murderers are equivalent to murderers, rapists to non-rapists, etc. But he does distinguish between the normal (non-neurotic) striving for superiority and the neurotic "superiority complex." The latter is distinguished by (1) an attempt to conceal an underlying inferiority complex, and by (2) not dealing realistically with one's own problems, and by (3) a failure to ground superiority claims in social interest, i.e., in the good or welfare of the community and/or of others in the community.

Social interest is defined as "an innate sense of kinship with all of humanity. This is the key difference between the way neurotics & normals strive for superiority. Normals are aware of other[s] and have high social interest. Neurotics are basically selfish with low social interest."

http://psych.eiu.edu/spencer/Adler.html

Veganism can be based, depending on the individual, in a normal striving for superiority or on a neurotic "superiority complex." Your psychologist implied that that your choice of veganism was the result of a neurotic "superiority complex." I think if you read up on Adler you can perhaps judge for yourself whether your veganism is part of a neurotic "superiority complex" or is rationally grounded in social interest.

I feel I've achieved a lot in going from hospitalized & living on disability & attemping suicide/self-mutilating, to self-supporting, working ft in high stress industry in the public eye,

If you don't mind my asking, why did your mental and physical state keep you from working, and how did you go from a state where you felt you needed hospitalization and state where you tried to harm yourself, to a state where you are self-supporting, and working in a high-stress industry, no less. ??

Did you need help to do this? If so, what kind of help? customized personal help or reading and learning? or no help?

If you don't mind my asking, why did your mental and physical state keep you from working, and how did you go from a state where you felt you needed hospitalization and state where you tried to harm yourself, to a state where you are self-supporting, and working in a high-stress industry, no less. ??

Did you need help to do this? If so, what kind of help? customized personal help or reading and learning? or no help?

I needed a LOT of help. The things that have helped are: supported work with other mental patients in the beginning, a supportive social services worker who helped me get back to school, an experimental antipsychotic & the ongoing care related to the drug study, a supportive bf, mental hospital programs, inpatient hospitalization, Shambhala study/meditation & nutrition/veganism.
Hope this helps.