A new report claims that, on average, men have higher IQs then women:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4183166.stm

Obviously, since the result isn't politically correct, the study is obviously wrong, all IQ measurements mean nothing, and the scientists involved should be shunned for the rest of their lives. :)

I don't think anyone with an IQ over 103.5 thinks that IQ scores are an unbiased estimator of intelligence. That we are learning that the tests are biased towards people who are similar in race, gender and background to the people who designed the tests should not come as a surprise.

The full study also points out that men have larger brains than women.

So maybe size does matter.

When I was a kid and going through my ADHD diagnosis, one of the first things they did was to give me an IQ test. My score showed me to be in the "genius" range (haha) - and the test takers even told my mother that I could have been scored higher - because some of my answers were creative and "correct" in some ways, but not in the way the test intended, so they couldn't give me points for them. The point of this story? Tests are a poor indicator of knowledge, or intelligence, in my opinion.

I think that tests do tend to favor some groups over others. Men and women think differently. intelligence is not something easily defined. I do not have issue with this study because it is "politically incorrect" - I take issue with it because intelligence is not just the ability to view complex items in 3D space in your mind.

I don't think anyone with an IQ over 103.5 thinks that IQ scores are an unbiased estimator of intelligence. That we are learning that the tests are biased towards people who are similar in race, gender and background to the people who designed the tests should not come as a surprise.

:idea:

Were the tests designed by men, or by women, or by both?

Is IQ actually significant? I know a lot of extremely smart people who are dumber than a box of hammers when it comes to practical life matters or even the ability to think critically.

Were the tests designed by men, or by women, or by both?

Is IQ actually significant? I know a lot of extremely smart people who are dumber than a box of hammers when it comes to practical life matters or even the ability to think critically.

Nobel prize winners average somewhere in the 130s and Field's medal winners somewhere in the 140s IIRC. Those people are certainly productive, I am not entirely sure whether or not all of them could balance a checkbook.

I don't think anyone with an IQ over 103.5 thinks that IQ scores are an unbiased estimator of intelligence. That we are learning that the tests are biased towards people who are similar in race, gender and background to the people who designed the tests should not come as a surprise.

Yup. This is a problem with many standardized tests. The "standard" is a white male.

>>The full study also points out that men have larger brains than women.

So maybe size does matter.>>

Although it does, in a statistically significant way, there are many, many outliers (I aspire to be one of them). That is, the correlation is rather weak.

>>I think that tests do tend to favor some groups over others. Men and women think differently. >>

How so? And why?

>>intelligence is not something easily defined.>>

I concur. More and more, I think intelligence is a qualitative constellation of abilities and inclinations rather than anything that may be validly quantified.

>>Is IQ actually significant?>>

IQ is externally valid insofar as it is predictive of later scholastic and career success. Beyond this, we're moving into the land of presupposition and circular definition.


ebola

I'd be more interested in how smart men think they are compare to how smart women think they they are. My sense is that men overestimate their intelligence (some even more than most, in my experience) whereas women more commonly underestimate and hide their intelligence, which is a shame. But then, that's just my sense of it.

I've read that men are more often found at the extremes of intelligence than women are. There are more extremely intelligent men than women, but there are also more extremely unintelligent ones.

This is apparently due in part to the fact that men only have one X chromosome, and any genes found on that chromosome aren't going to be tempered (as in women) by those on another X. So if a man has a single allele on his X that favours high intelligence, it won't have another dragging it down.

Perhaps this might have something to do with it? Just speculation.

The Y chromosome in males has a tendency to soak up genetic mutations, due to having no chromosome to pair itself with. That may be a factor as well.

If you are curious about the correlation between IQ and other factors in life, wikipedia has a decent chart:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ#Practical_importance

My personal opinion, based on nothing but personal conversations with men and women, and personal observation of their actions, leads me to believe that on the whole, women are smarter and cleverer than men. Absolutely no doubt. But of course there seem to be many individual women who are dumber than the average man, some are dumber than most men, and many individual men who seem to be smarter than the average woman, and some are smarter than most women.

*shrug*. . . I think some women are smarter than men, some men are smarter than women. I don't think gender is really a factor...

I've read that men are more often found at the extremes of intelligence than women are. There are more extremely intelligent men than women, but there are also more extremely unintelligent ones.

This is apparently due in part to the fact that men only have one X chromosome, and any genes found on that chromosome aren't going to be tempered (as in women) by those on another X. So if a man has a single allele on his X that favours high intelligence, it won't have another dragging it down.

I've read this as well.

I agree with remilard, that the tests are measuring what the test makers valued as "signs of intelligence" -- but you know... one thing that bothers me about IQ tests is that they often only measure logical thinking and pattern recognition, rather than critical thinking skills and lateral thought.

I believe that our culture reinforces logical thinking in boys from a young age, and creative thinking in women. So is IQ measuring "actual intelligence" or is it measuring how well someone has developed their socially-reinforced manner of thinking?

Of course I am generalizing & stereotyping, but from a general perspective, I do think that men & women are encouraged to think in different ways as children, and that's reinforced throughout adolesence. And IQ tests are a reflection of that.

*shrug*. . . I think some women are smarter than men, some men are smarter than women. I don't think gender is really a factor...

Agreed...

No matter how this turns out, we'll still have to take people we meet as individuals.

Do the IQ test makers have a variety of cultural, age, and gender backgrounds represented? If the test makers are smart enough to create the test, they should also be smart enough to realize potential biases.

Do the IQ test makers have a variety of cultural, age, and gender backgrounds represented?

I don't see how the tests would reflect those differences. They're always about recognizing patterns/shapes, figuring out puzzles, etc. How do you take demographics into account for that? hmm

Maybe certain demographics tend to receive less training in some types of patterns, shapes, and puzzles. Some people do well at teaching themselves, while others need a nudge (or more) to get going.

I don't see how the tests would reflect those differences. They're always about recognizing patterns/shapes, figuring out puzzles, etc. How do you take demographics into account for that? hmm
Most of the tests I've taken had "odd one out" questions, which can be about culture. Some of the word puzzles would also be impossible to solve because the words chosen for the tests are often unused in day to day life.

As for the in-person tests with someone sitting across a little table from the participant with a clipboard and stopwatch...for starters there's someone sitting across from them with a clipboard and stopwatch. Many tests given in that setting have more than one answer, some where the individual's upbringing would determine the answer they choose.

I don't see how the tests would reflect those differences. They're always about recognizing patterns/shapes, figuring out puzzles, etc. How do you take demographics into account for that? hmm

There is a verbal portion.

yeah i remember now. i had forgotten about that.

yeah i remember now. i had forgotten about that.

There is a memory portion too.

what are you talking about?

:p

I don't think IQ tests are an accurate way of testing intelligence... Many IQ tests have a lot of grafical questions, in which men are I think better on average then women. A lot of tests have a time limit, or else use the time in the calculation, wich effects the outcome for people with reading problems, like dislectic people... And, you get better results after practising, which means you can get an higher IQ, but I doubt your intelligence increased:)

Anyway, even if it is true on average, I'm still more intelligent then most men:p