I'm not sure if this (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/chitribts/20050618/ts_chicagotrib/durbintriestoquellangeroverremarks) is causing as much of a stir other places as it is here in Illinois. Honestly, I'm not a fan of the "compare someone to a Nazi" method, but the man has a point. :yes:

I'm not sure if this (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/chitribts/20050618/ts_chicagotrib/durbintriestoquellangeroverremarks) is causing as much of a stir, as it is here in Illinois. Honestly, I'm not a fan of the "compare someone to a Nazi" method, but the man has a point. :yes:
Yes he has a point, it's on the top of his head. Comparing Gitmo to Cambodia and Nazi death camps?

Well, he didn't compare the camps overall, but rather the behavior/torture being described at Guantanamo. I think that's the whole idea..to make Americans think "Is this really something that I want my government/military to be doing?"

Well if that was the point, which I question, it was completly buried in all the comparissions and lost.

Yeah..see that's what I'm afraid of. People heard the "other N word" and tuned out. I've been waiting to see what our junior Senator has to say, but so far Mr. Obama has been silent.

it's political dynamite for all involved. the reason durbin has had to backtrack is outrage from constituents. these are conservative times. obama is laying low for good reason. what would you say if you were him?

if we don't have the ability to be critical of ourselves, then we are looking at nazi times, maybe sooner than later.

Torture, etc. is not a national thing, it's a human thing. To think that Cambodians or Germans are capable of something that we, Americans, the Noblest and Purest who have ever lived (because at least we're free!), are not is foolish. For Bush and others to dismiss the possiblity so flippantly is discouraging. Of course it's possible, and it should be looked into, to the world's satisfaction.

:up:

The Rev

I wouldnt be surprised that there has been abuse. But to compare it to Gulags, and Nazi death camps is irresponsible and politicly motovatied.

I wouldnt be surprised that there has been abuse. But to compare it to Gulags, and Nazi death camps is irresponsible and politicly motovatied.

I agree with this.

:rolleyes: Republicans say more outrageous things like this all the time and nobody calls them on it. There was a recent example of a republican making a much more ridiculous comparison to Nazi Germany but I'm having trouble remembering it now. I'll post it when I remember. Nobody said a word about it except on Air America.

I have no objection to Durbin's comments. He did not say that our methods are just like those used in the most vile and oppressive prison camps; he said that if one heard about the methods being used without knowing where the events were occurring, one might suspect that they were methods used by those horrible regimes. The right is deflecting criticism of the abuses by attacking the messenger.

A quote used by an Israeli historian (not sure when) in comment to comparisons being made between Israeli policies and the Nazis works very well here: "The issue isn't whether or not we are the same as the Nazis; the issue is that we aren't different enough."

This is Durbin's concern: we aren't different enough right now.

I wouldnt be surprised that there has been abuse. But to compare it to Gulags, and Nazi death camps is irresponsible and politicly motovatied.

I agree that the comparison is not accurate at this point.

But I think that Guantanamo and other situations are a few steps along the way towards becoming death camps, and that we should check ourselves NOW and stop accepting it NOW before it goes that far.

What Durbin originally said is essentially correct. All this quibbling over the "accuracy" of his comparison merely clouds the issue. What we're doing is wrong, and it doesn't matter to what degree. I hate like hell my tax money is being used for such Nazi, commie, Attila-the-Hun, Satanic practices. It's against every principle of liberty ever conceived. It is, in short, un-American. Durbin shouldn't have backed down. The real question is, should the commander-in-chief be lobotomised? Not being a doctor, I don't know what complications might arise, from such micro-surgery. We don't want to be cruel, do we?

What we're doing is wrong, and it doesn't matter to what degree.
See, I'm not so sure. Nothing I have read seems all that bad.

See, I'm not so sure. Nothing I have read seems all that bad.
Go back to sleep, Tame. You're dreaming.

Go back to sleep, Tame. You're dreaming.

Whatever, sunshine.

I'm not sure that it was politically motivated, mostly because it would be kinda stupid. Despite the Dem. leanings in IL's Senatorial history, much of the state is fiercely conservative and pro-military. Durbin intentionally insulting these folks would be *bad* for his political career, not helpful. Honestly, I think he just got carried away....he (and many others) see the abuses as something that should outrage Americans. Yet, many seem to turn a blind eye, or perhaps are just unaware.

or they just don't care, which is the case, i think. in these days of terror alerts, i don't think most americans care how we treat others. many have been hardened by media images of islamists sawing people's heads off, and if we treat them like animals, it's because they deserve it.

Eh, I read the FBI agent's report of abuse, as well as some other accounts. Nothing that would even remotely raise my eyebrows. This ain't tiddlywinks, and it sure doesn't compare to the Nazis.

On a side note, I think Dick Durbin would be a great porn name.

durbin poisen is an ass kicking marijuana strain :).

I'm not sure that it was politically motivated, mostly because it would be kinda stupid. Despite the Dem. leanings in IL's Senatorial history, much of the state is fiercely conservative and pro-military. Durbin intentionally insulting these folks would be *bad* for his political career, not helpful. Honestly, I think he just got carried away....he (and many others) see the abuses as something that should outrage Americans. Yet, many seem to turn a blind eye, or perhaps are just unaware.
I wish more of our pros in D.C. would get "carried away" that way. Nothing wrong with showing a little guts once in awhile.

I agree with this.

Ditto.

:D

The Rev

If I were in charge i'd apply Godwin's Law and revoke his speaking time for the rest of the congressional session.