Anyone have any thoughts on whether fish should be kept as pets? I was contemplating getting some fish now that I have a home, but part of me thinks it's wrong and part of me doesn't.

I'm sure if you keep your eyes and ears open enough, you could find someone with some fish they can no longer take care of. But let me warn you, they can be expensive and time consuming to take care of well.

I have one my dad bought for me long ago. I like goldfish, but I do not want to buy anymore bc I don't want to support the breeding of more fish to be sold in petstores.

I wouldn't buy fish but Thalia's right, you could probably find some "used." You might want to check with the Humane Society and ask them to call you if they get any in (I doubt they would but you can ask). I had thought about getting a bird and even though they never seem to have any that's how I was going to go about it.

I have had fish all my life. I love my pets (have 2 cats, 1 dog, and African cichlids and saltwater reef tank).

Only this past year have I felt a twinge of guilt keeping fish, but I already have them, and I'm not going to give them away to someone who doesn't know how to care for my fish.

If you do decide to go for the fish, find a good LFS (local fish store), and don't support the commercial fish stores who don't treat their animals nicely. Find a few good fish message boards (I can give you links to Cichlids or Saltwater tanks), and most have local clubs, and when someone moves, they sell or give away their nice setups and fish.

If you are concerned about keeping live fish and the moral issues of that, you might look into a reef tank. Get some live rock/sand (teeming with helpful bacteria), and a few colorful live corals, and you've got a beautiful ecosystem that is a wonder and awe everyday. Although saltwater is quite an expensive hobby. Lights alone can cost ya $800 if you want the metal halides which are best for the corals and creates the ripples of light on the sand.

I love the challenge of maintaining these systems. Do not get fish if you are not ready to change the water every few weeks. With a reef tank, you don't need to change the water, but with the African cichlid and reef tanks, you need to keep clean water of the correct pH and such. It takes me a few hours to create reverse osmosis water and then put in the right nutrients for my fish.

I must admit it is a joy to see them, and they are very happy and colorful and beautiful. It can be an addictive hobby, at one time, we had 4 tanks setup, with a few hospital/quarantine tanks ready in case of emergencies (which we haven't had to use yet).

Any other questions, just ask me. :)

On a similar note to what dnd said, you could have a tank with just some freshwater plants from the local pet store. Some aquatic plants blossom and everything. Almost all plants have some sort of snail eggs on them, so you will eventually end up with snails, too. (This is currently causing me a dilemma, I have decided to try to kill the eggs, but not the snails, but they are over populating).

But the snails are cute little fellows and they eat the algae.

Oh dear. I find snails to be rather disturbing, even if they are safely imprisoned in glass tanks. What if one grows really, really big, over night, climbs out of the tank, and decides to get into bed with me?

Pictures of my pet snail.

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn7427.html

Bigger:

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/H/I-SM-HASP-AD.017.html

And a slug of course being basicly a snail sans a shell.

http://gardenphotos.com/samplers/pests/3.html

I agree with what's been said; try to find someone who wants to get rid of their fish. Most pet store fish are wild caught. If you do decide to buy from a pet store, make sure to ask where the fish came from (from the wild, or from breeders). Don't support catching fish from the wild, it's bad for the ecosystem that they came from, plus the fish usually aren't as healthy, because they have difficulty adapting to a captive environment.

the only time i get to see snails lately is when they are smooshed b/c meanies cant watch their feet. poor little guys. i do remember them to be cute lil devils tho

When you buy plants you can soak them in Potassium permanganate which kills the snail eggs. You can also bait them by attaching a string to a piece of cucumber at night, in the morning it should have a good number of of snails on it and then it can be removed (what then to do with the snails is also of concern to me). If you have fish, don't overfeed snails eat the leftovers, also keeping the surface gravel vacuumed and free of waste prevents amonia which helps algae growth. By having less algae there is less food for snails.

I used to have fish but gave them to a couple of people who were going to buy more from a "pet" store. Rather than have them support the theft of wild animals or the domestic breeding of these animals (as i once supported), I figured I could lessen the harm by giving them my companions. I could no longer watch as they kept having fry and populating my tank. It seemed cruel to perpetuate a life lived inside glass walls. Plus if you have fish you often have to watch them suffer from ailments and all fish eventually die.

If an aquarium is what you want you can have one with plants, which is what I did with mine. I now have a 75 gallon planted display which still garnishes just as many compliments.

If you go saltwater, you may want snails and hermit crabs, they will help with the algae. We have a 75 gallon, and it was recommended that we get ourselves 300 snails/crabs, etc... to help with algae. Oh, the algae disappeared in 3 days and the tank is spotless clean, but now we have to throw in algae supplements for food. So, 300 snails is excessive, lol.

For my freshwater cichlids, I chose all males. Surprisingly, they all get along and haven't had any fry yet. It's been a year, and they've been pretty healthy, but I do take good care of them.

Originally posted by Jeremy Alcorn
When you buy plants you can soak them in Potassium permanganate which kills the snail eggs. You can also bait them by attaching a string to a piece of cucumber at night, in the morning it should have a good number of of snails on it and then it can be removed (what then to do with the snails is also of concern to me). If you have fish, don't overfeed snails eat the leftovers, also keeping the surface gravel vacuumed and free of waste prevents amonia which helps algae growth. By having less algae there is less food for snails.
Yes, I read about the potassium permanganate thing after I got my plants. I actually soaked mine in a mild chlorine solution, and physically tried to rinse off anything, but those eggs are tough. I don't feel good killing them once they are past the egg stage, but I noticed that they reproduced very quickly at first, but now they are populating more slowly. I hope they find an equilibrium. You can also buy fish that eat snails, but that is a whole other dilemma.

In case you do decide on fish, my favorite freshwater are African Cichlids. They are very colorful and almost as beautiful as saltwater fish, and they are the most intelligent fish. Here's my favorite cichlid forums:
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/

In case you want to take a plunge and go reef, here's the best reef forums:
http://reefcentral.com/forums/

:)

The more I debate it the more I think I'll hold off on getting any fish. I probably wouldn't have the time. Instead, I'll get a pool table.

About eight years ago I bought a pet snake because I wanted a pet, but I didn't have the time to care for a higher-maintenance pet. I still have him and love him, but I don't think I would ever have another "caged" pet (reptiles, fish, birds, rodents, etc.), because I have these moments of guilt. Even though I let Adam (the snake) roam around his room free for days at a time, I can't give him too much freedom for fear he'll get lost (I've lost him before on a couple of occasions). He was born in captivity and has never had to hunt for food or fight predators and I don't think he'd last long on his own. I've even had weird guilt dreams about him. So, no fish for me...

I was just thinking about this the other day.

My bf is buying this huge aquarium with an intention off setting up some fish. When I say big I mean it is 2 metre in length. I haven't really been to sure how I feel about it. I think it is good that he is researching allot of the native plants and things to put in the water and getting some rocks/drift wood to create a bit of a natural type environment.

It still weirds me out though, because of the whole caged thing.

I went to this place the other week to buy my cat a cat house thing. It is a pet supplies shop, but uptairs they have like this huge aquarium set up. They have sea horses up there as well. It just seems wrong, a sea horse in a tank. Is there really a difference between a sea horse and a fish? Or a sea horse and a cat. I wouldn't keep my cat in a cage. I wouldn't keep a bird in a cage.

Anyway, there is nothing I can really do about it. And I guess the sad fact is that by him keeping these fish in a huge natural type tank, it acually isn't *that* objecteable to me. That is what kind of upsets me I guess. I spend much time telling ppl that "yes, fish is an animal," but when it comes down to the crunch, do I really treat fish to the same standards as other say a bird or dog. Seems not.

I started a 30 gallon aquarium about 4-5 years ago, and the only remaining survivors are one cherry barb and the plants. Adapting to a new environment is stressful for fish, and it seems needlessly cruel to have to subject them to all that just so I can have the pleasure of looking at them whenever I want.

Maybe after the fish dies (he's practically elderly by normal standards) I'll just keep it running for the plants.

Cheeno said:

Or a sea horse and a cat. I wouldn't keep my cat in a cage. I wouldn't keep a bird in a cage.

For some, the cage is still there, only different..
for some, the cat's cage is the house.
It may be a different sort of cage, but nonetheless, a cage, IMHO.

Many people with birds have cages, but let them out during the day or whenever they are home...I know one person who only uses the cage, because the bird likes to sleep on top of it.
I know that kathym has a bird, and would never want to part with it...
Both mouse and I have fish, and I like my cichlids

:D

Why is it different that some choose cats or dogs, while others choose fish and birds?
Don't they all serve the same function?
I chose my fish, because I am not allowed to have cat/dog and would most likely not want the responsibility of either...
The fish, to me, are calming, intriguing and fun to watch. Frankly I don't think they know whether they live in their natural environment, or not (nor do they care) ...if it's all they've ever known, how could it NOT be natural?


:confused: :D

I understand that ppl keep birds and cats and dogs and fish in "cages."
This is not a judgement on them or what they do.

I was more so talking about my own feelings about not being *comfortable* with a bird in a cage, but still being not *too* upset over the idea of a fish in a tank.
:)

Originally posted by catmorrison
Cheeno said:Why is it different that some choose cats or dogs, while others choose fish and birds?
Don't they all serve the same function?

I like to look at it from a Utilitarian standpoint:

The main difference is that by taking guardianship of a cat or dog (from an animal shelter), you're alleviating suffering, as animals will not have to be put to death.

By purchasing fish, or a cat from a kitten mill, it encourages those companies to continue their actions and churn out more animals for money, solely for our amusement.

That said, I'm still on the fence about fish. If you buy them from a responsible pet store and provide a good environment for them, I wouldn't lose any sleep over getting some. Personally I suck at taking care of fish, so I'll probably stick with the plants.

By purchasing fish, or a cat from a kitten mill, it encourages those companies to continue their actions and churn out more animals for money, solely for our amusement.

I understand what you are saying, but I would argue, that, it is indeed MUCH easier to adopt cats/dogs, than fish or birds...
There just is not the same availability when comparing dogs/cats to fish/birds. If that were true, they would be readily adoptable, and they aren't.

And since they are all soley for our amusement, I think that, that point is irrelevant. IMHO, that's a given.

I think there aren't as many fish/birds because they are more likely to die from neglect. Same with snakes, spiders, lizards, etc.

I think there aren't as many fish/birds because they are more likely to die from neglect. Same with snakes, spiders, lizards, etc.

I'm not convinced it's as simple as that, Michael...
For one thing, most people are not going to travel to Africa to acquire cichlids...
Would you travel to Africa, to purhcase an exotic cat, if the pet store had one, or the shelter down the street?
Yet I can be guaranteed that
I can go to any shelter down the street and NOT find one fish or bird...
The same with birds...when you think of how hard it would be to even catch one....LOL
not the same with dogs/cats...they are availabe, and not difficult to catch or acquire..
Additionally, there are few laws that protect either birds or fish, from neglect or inhumane treatment, so I am sure they just aren't as visible as dog/cats...as most do not regard them as the same, IMHO.
Another factor, to consider, is that most cat/dogs are adapted and domesticated, wheras as fish and birds really aren't...they seem less hardy to me, than cats/dogs...less resistant to diseases, etc than most dogs/cats...
Again this would seem to at least, have very little to do with neglect, as opposed to supply and the difference in species...
All that seems to be indepedent of *neglect* IMHO.:D

I agree with what you're saying but from my own experience I have seen hamsters dying in their own filth because people are too lazy to clean the cage. I've also seen plenty of people get trendy pets only to lose interest because they can't really do anything with them. I think animals that are not mammals, novelty animals, or and/or those that are not able to effectively express their needs are far more likely to die of neglect.

Just my opinion based on what I've seen. It's obviously not something that can be proven.

I think that's true. I have lived with my snake for eight years. Once I had to take him to the vet because he hadn't eaten for seven weeks (this turned out to be normal), and the vet was surprised at how long I had had him and how healthy he was. He's a herpetologist and says that most people don't care for their reptiles very well and they don't live very long. Also, at the pet store where I buy Adam's (my snake's) frozen mice, I always have to special order them because everyone around here feeds their reptiles live prey. It's much better to feed them thawed rodents because it's kinder to the rodent, first of all, but also because there is a chance that live prey can injure the snake. The pet store people said that they try to encourage people to buy frozen instead of live, but that most people want the "show" of seeing the snake kill the mouse. So I think most people get "exotic" pets for the novelty of it, not because they actually care for animals. (I realize that some people on this list would find buying the frozen mice to be cruel as well, but since snakes are pure carnivores, I can't exactly feed Adam a brussel sprout instead.)