the incrowd debate

[LadyFaile]

ok i know this has been brought up many times before. and well, that's cause it's been an issue for a while and is still an issue.
some of you may not see it as a problem or don't think there is an incrowd, or think it's a big joke, and that's fine. if you don't want to contribute to this thread you don't have to and i'd rather not have any negative comments.

this isn't so we can gripe about members we think are cliquey or debate the existance of cliques, i don't want to name names and that sort of thing, i think we can keep this civil

after posting about this in Michael's thread and getting lots of replies and pm's from people that feel the same way, i think we should try to do something. also from the replies and from past discussions it seems obvious to me that the cliquey folks don't realize that they are even being cliquey. i think it's a simple matter of everyone not getting to know everyone after the vegweb merge (that's when most of the clique complaints started happening am i right?) i think introducing so many people from two huge groups together in one shot, it was just too hard for everyone to get to know everyone and so everyone split off into smaller groups. now any new members that join are automatic outcasts and i don't think that's right.

so i'm sure everyone can agree that we'd like vb to be a happy welcoming place where nobody feels left out, so i hope we can all contribute ideas to find a solution.

i know we've had threads in the past that are meant for everyone to get to know each other, but i find 9 times out of 10 they're just the 'incrowd' folks who already know each other having fun. which is great, i can't complain about people having fun. but it's obvious that these threads don't work too well at introducing members to each other.
the pm question thing was a good idea but it didn't work as well as it could have, lots of people forgot to empty their inboxes or weren't online for most of it etc...

any ideas for threads, forums, activities, anything.. please post here. old ideas revisited or new ideas, whatever.

[LadyFaile]

ok so whatever happened to the adopt a newbie program? volunteers would have the job of introducing themselves to a newbie, answering their questions, and making sure they feel welcome. we could expand on that and say the adopter should reply to posts the adoptee makes for the first few days, especially if it looks like nobody else is replying. sometimes it only takes one reply to get everyone else posting.

we can easily promise to reply to more people's threads and talk to people other than our close vb friends, but how do we make sure we keep the promise? maybe have a "reach-out" thread where someone would issue a challenge every day and you post when you've completed that challenge. stuff like "pm 2 people today" or "introduce yourself to 3 newbies today"

[Tame]

FWIW, I think there is an "in crowd", for lack of a better term. I don't think it is by design...more of something that just happens in certain settings.

I think your reach-out thread may be the best option.

And in all honesty, am I part of this in crowd? I think it has been implied that I am by others, but I feel pretty alienated here most of the time. Doesn't really bother me, but it is a definite feel I have been getting.

[meatless]

And in all honesty, am I part of this in crowd? I think it has been implied that I am by others, but I feel pretty alienated here most of the time. Doesn't really bother me, but it is a definite feel I have been getting.


aw tamey-kins :hug: :lol:

Yes, I'd say you are, if only because you're a part of so many "inside jokes." And a lot of times the new people come here and don't realize right off the bat that there's really no point in arguing with you since you're so set in your ways, and end up being scared off by you. JMO.

It's hard to define an in-crowd though. All I know is LF and I were PMing a bit about it, and what stood out to us is that even though she's been around forever and I've been here two years, it feels like a lot of the time our posts are not responded to, passed by etc. yet there's no shortage of posts in the slut threads etc. Even sometimes when I've ventured into the ETL threads my posts have been completely ignored, so I don't bother anymore. So I can only imagine if people who have been here 2-4 years feel this way how newbies must feel.

[LadyFaile]

Tame, you're in your own crowd, one that the rest of us could only hope to be cool enough to join :tame:

personally i have no desire to be popular and i didn't start all this for attention or for the sake of whining, i just thought if i notice this going on so do others, and i've seen it happen to others, noticed other people feeling unwelcome or whatever, and just thought maybe we could try to do something about it. what the heck there doesn't seem to be much going on at the moment.

[LadyFaile]

all else fails Meatless and i are gonna start our own clique. and then... the WORLD!! mwuahahahahaha... oh. i've said too much.

[meatless]

I just want to add to my post that i've "come to terms" with things as they are on VB, and have no special desire to stand out. It used to hurt my feelings, but I don't really care anymore and don't have a lot of time to post here anyway. But, I do think as an observer that the in-crowd phenomena can be harmful to a sense of community.

[Amy SF]

For myself, I decided months ago:

1. To always post a welcome greeting in every Introduce Yourself thread. I figure the more welcome greetings there are, the more welcomed the newbie feels.

2. To try to post a response in every thread that doesn't seem to be getting any (or just one or two) responses. However, this does not guarantee that the thread will receive any more responses after mine.

As for threads that I've started, I've noticed that the sillier the subject, the more likely that people will respond to my threads. The threads that I feel are more "serious" don't seem to garner much interest from people. I guess the "cliquiness" on VB might explain this, since there are other "serious" threads created by others that get plenty of responses.

I do understand that a lot of subject duplication occurs on VB, especially since newbies join every day and may not take the time and/or effort to search VB for information, and longtime users may not want to continually post the same information again and again. For this reason, I think that the idea of "newbie adoption" may not be a bad one. Do remember, however, that reading and posting on VB, as addicting as it can be, may not always be a top priority for a lot of users. Real life does come first.

[meatless]

all else fails Meatless and i are gonna start our own clique. and then... the WORLD!! mwuahahahahaha... oh. i've said too much.

:lol: :sealed:

[vggiegirl]

FWIW LF, Tame and Meatless..

I always think of you guys as part of the "in" crowd. In crowd or not...I hope you feel the love :love:

[LadyFaile]

I just want to add to my post that i've "come to terms" with things as they are on VB, and have no special desire to stand out. It used to hurt my feelings, but I don't really care anymore and don't have a lot of time to post here anyway. But, I do think as an observer that the in-crowd phenomena can be harmful to a sense of community.

exactly my thoughts. except for the no time to post.. :o

[meatless]

I do understand that a lot of subject duplication occurs on VB, especially since newbies join every day and may not take the time and/or effort to search VB for information, and longtime users may not want to continually post the same information again and again. For this reason, I think that the idea of "newbie adoption" may not be a bad one. Do remember, however, that reading and posting on VB, as addicting as it can be, may not always be a top priority for a lot of users. Real life does come first.


I think that's why quite often I personally refrain from posting. Lots of times I've already read a zillion threads on a topic and just don't have the time or energy to reply every time it comes up again.

I certainly wouldn't suggest that VB is a top priority for everyone. It certainly isn't for me, between my full time career, two side jobs, husband, cats, house, friends etc. I guess it's not like anyone can tell anyone else where to post, but it seems like an awful lot of energy goes into, like you said, "silly" threads where there's a lot of banter between existing friends on the board.

[Amy SF]

I want to add:

In-jokes. I think they alienate newbies. Please consider saving them strictly for PMs.

Abbreviations. Either stop using them altogether, or explain what they mean. :rolleyes:

[meatless]

FWIW LF, Tame and Meatless..

I always think of you guys as part of the "in" crowd. In crowd or not...I hope you feel the love :love:


LOL that's just because you looooove us.

Since I returned to VB a few months ago I have really stayed out of most threads and kept it to threads on issues pertaining to the reason I came here in the first place- vegetarianism, veganism, environmentalism, and AR. I also prowl for impressionable newbies that I can indoctrinate. :devil: :lol:

[LadyFaile]

yeah i get the priorities thing and that not everyone spends hours here like me :o

but if we did the newbie adoption and reach out things it would just sorta be if you're here anyways and have time, check what new challenge is posted. there wouldn't be a time limit and you wouldn't have to do a certain number of challenges in a certain amount of time sorta thing, it's just if you have time, do a challenge.
we'd just have to work out a way to post only one challenge a day so nobody's ideas for a challenge get stepped on. like maybe post it the night before so nobody has to be on through the day to choose a challenge and babysit the thread so we don't get a bunch of challenges posted at the same time etc. i don't mind posting it at night but i don't come online early enough in the day usually.

i can't remember who was running the adopt-a-newbie thing before, maybe they or someone who participated can post how it was run and see if enough people are interested in trying it.

[jenna rose]

For myself, I decided months ago:

1. To always post a welcome greeting in every Introduce Yourself thread. I figure the more welcome greetings there are, the more welcomed the newbie feels.

2. To try to post a response in every thread that doesn't seem to be getting any (or just one or two) responses. However, this does not guarantee that the thread will receive any more responses after mine.

As for threads that I've started, I've noticed that the sillier the subject, the more likely that people will respond to my threads. The threads that I feel are more "serious" don't seem to garner much interest from people. I guess the "cliquiness" on VB might explain this, since there are other "serious" threads created by others that get plenty of responses.



You were reading my mind on this one - those were all things that I wanted to say. You also explained it a lot better than I could, as I can't always explain things well.

[jenna rose]

Even sometimes when I've ventured into the ETL threads my posts have been completely ignored, so I don't bother anymore.


What is ETL? :confused:

[LadyFaile]

eat to live i think

[meatless]

Yes, Eat to Live

[Tame]

In-jokes. I think they alienate newbies. Please consider saving them strictly for PMs.

Sorry, but that will never happen in any active community. Newbies can't expect to pop on and know everything.



Abbreviations. Either stop using them altogether, or explain what they mean. :rolleyes:

Again, see above.

[vggiegirl]

I agree with Tame on that....when I was new here I was like wtf are these people talking about half the time. The longer you stay the more you learn.
And abbreviations aren't going anywhere...it's just part of internet culture. I really like abbrv. fwiw

[shagginabit]

I don't really notice too much of an in crowd thing, but I'm sure its there.

[The Rev]

To me, there are people I know, and people I don't. If I know you, I consider you part of my "crowd." If I don't, I figure I'll get to know you eventually. Does anyone see it differently than this?

I don't have a problem with newbs feeling a bit left out at first. That's just the way it is with people. If you want to make friends, you have to go out there and get to know some people. If those people all know each other to begin with, then you'll feel left out, because they feel more comfortable with each other than with someone new. You just have to get to know them. That's all I did when I was new.

Now, if you have people deliberately excluding new people, or playing the "You're not cool enough to hang with us" BS, then that's definitely a problem. So far, tho, I haven't seen that here at all.

:sunny:

The Rev

[LadyFaile]

the problem is some of us do see that sometimes. mostly though it's as we've said. people who are good friends here will post back and forth back and forth and anyone that posts in the middle gets ignored. it's hard to get to know people when they don't read your posts or reply when you ask them a question or make a comment etc. you feel like they can't be bothered with you. so you stay out of their threads and they continue on being too cool for you and you continue on posting your own threads in hopes of getting replies which sometimes works sometimes doesn't. any serious threads i post get replies usually, ones asking for health advice etc, but anything fun i try to post gets buried.

anyways like i said in the OP this isn't here so we can debate the existance of the incrowd or gripe about it, i just wanted ideas on how we can make this a more community-like community for all of us.

[Amy SF]

the problem is some of us do see that sometimes. mostly though it's as we've said. people who are good friends here will post back and forth back and forth and anyone that posts in the middle gets ignored. it's hard to get to know people when they don't read your posts or reply when you ask them a question or make a comment etc. you feel like they can't be bothered with you. so you stay out of their threads and they continue on being too cool for you and you continue on posting your own threads in hopes of getting replies which sometimes works sometimes doesn't. any serious threads i post get replies usually, ones asking for health advice etc, but anything fun i try to post gets buried.

anyways like i said in the OP this isn't here so we can debate the existance of the incrowd or gripe about it, i just wanted ideas on how we can make this a more community-like community for all of us.

Well, if Michael creates a "New Veg*an* support forum, as he suggested, that would be one step in the right direction.