Well my friend and I got into a disagreement about this the other day. I dont have anything against someone who is gay but i personally dont think they should be allowed to adopt kids. Its only natural for a man and woman to have kids.

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Its only natural for a man and woman to have kids.

Wow. I just don't get that. Absolutely it should be legal. Because it's only natural for people to want and have kids.

uh...

so, luckiecharms, how do you feel about het' couples who can't naturally concieve, and end up adopting or using fetility drugs?

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Well my friend and I got into a disagreement about this the other day. I dont have anything against someone who is gay but i personally dont think they should be allowed to adopt kids. Its only natural for a man and woman to have kids.
Shouldn't the question be what is good for the child? If they can provide a loving home, why not? There are a lot of kids in foster care an orphanages (sp?) who need love.

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Well my friend and I got into a disagreement about this the other day. I dont have anything against someone who is gay but i personally dont think they should be allowed to adopt kids. Its only natural for a man and woman to have kids.

Just curious, what do you base your decision on?

I sometimes try and put myself in others shoes. If I'm the child, do I want to continue boucing from foster parent to foster parent? Probably not. Stability is always a good thing for young people. Do I want to remain in the state's custody in a state run facility? Probably not. It lacks the one on one and the closeness of a realtionship with a loving parental figures. What's the other option? Adoption. Hey, but what if there isn't a male/female figure that is willing to adopt me. Or, maybe I'm bi-racial, or asian, or some other ethniticity who's chances of being chosen for adoption are fewer. Maybe I'm past the 'cute' age. But this other couple, of the same sex, finds it in their heart to take me into their home and love me like I was their own. Do I turn them away because it's not your traditional relationship? I wouldn't. Love doesn't know a face or gender, it just knows. Everyone needs to be loved and if it happens to come from a gay couple, so?? Their sexual preferrence doesn't make them any more or less capable of successfully raising and loving a child.

Now, if I were in the shoes of the couple, my options are adoption, invetro fertilization, or a surrogate mother. The later two are more expensive than adoption. Plus, there are plenty of children already in the world that need loving parents. I believe I would choose adoption out of the three options. So, in answer to your post, I don't find anything wrong with a gay couple adopting.

Originally posted by luckiecharms
I dont have anything against someone who is gay but i personally dont think they should be allowed to adopt kids.

If you don't think they should be allowed to adopt kids, then you obviously DO have something against gay people.

Well when i try to put myself in the kids shoes i think i would be suicidal. They would constantly be made fun of, picked on, and talked about. It seems that people never judge you by who you are on the inside but by other things which i dont think is right. I guess that it doesnt seem fair what all the kid would have to go through.

Only two people of the opposite gender can have kids and its meant to be that way for one reason or another.

Btw, i dont intend to offend anyone here with my opinions. i like it here i like how you can post your thoughts and opinions about things.

Ok, folks. I gotta walk away from this one. See ya.

yeah, this is hardcore ignorance.

luckiecharms, you may or may not know it, but your homophobic opinions are NOT welcome here. at least, not by me.

i suggest you do some reading about the fight for gay rights, and experiences of gay people, before you talk about this any more. it is painfully obvious you don't anything about it.

Originally posted by Poesía
If you don't think they should be allowed to adopt kids, then you obviously DO have something against gay people.

Thank you Poesia... :up:

I have never understood why some people feel that homosexuals cannot make good parents. Where do people get that idea? Kids should be raised by a mother and a father? Give me a break!!! Kids should be raised by someone who loves them. Single moms, single dads... where do they fit into your notion of ideal parenting? And in what universe is it better to let a child stay in an orphanage or foster care rather than adopt them to a couple that happens to be of the same gender?

There are so many children who need love, security, and a good home. And a lot of those children are in 'straight' families. Having both a mother and a father is no guarantee that the child will be treated well. I wasn't.

I know so many gay couples who would make wonderful parents, but because it is so difficult for gays to adopt, they gave up on that dream a long time ago.... :(

I believe that homosexuals should have the right to adopt.

If a child is in a secure and loving home, it doesn't matter what the rest of the world thinks. Kids will be bullies for any number of reasons, should we also not allow biracial families, single parent families, step-families simply because the children may or may not get teased for it? Of course not. Our society will never acheive equal rights if we give in to the pressures of what is considered "normal" and deny basic rights to some members of the population.

I grew up in a "normal" household, I had a mother and a father. And I was suicidal. Having a mom and a dad didn't stop people from picking on me, and being straight did not mean that they were good parents. Given the choice, I would gladly have been adopted into a loving family with a same sex couple. Like MsRuthieB said, the most important thing a child needs is stability and love.

Originally posted by Kreeli
yeah, this is hardcore ignorance.

luckiecharms, you may or may not know it, but your homophobic opinions are NOT welcome here. at least, not by me.

and Kreeli wins a round of applause from the VB Community!!!!!

:up: :up:

I am proud to be a part of a community (both online and in RL) that supports diversity, individuality, and personal integrity. Thank you.

OUT and PROUD,
Randy

http://www.mediawatchers.nl/smileys/boksen.gif

From www.lethimstay.com :

Steve Lofton, 44, and Roger Croteau, 46, live in Portland, Oregon, with their five foster kids: Frank, 14, Tracy, 14, Bert, 10, Wayne, 8, and Ernie, 5. When they were infants, Frank, Tracy, and Bert were placed with Steve and Roger by Florida's Department of Children and Families. Wayne and Ernie were placed with the family by the state of Oregon three years ago.

Frank, Tracy, and Bert were all placed with Steve and Roger when they were infants. None of them had parents who could care for them, and they languished in hospitals—until, one by one, Steve and Roger brought them home, where they've been ever since.

At the state's request, Steve quit his job to be with the children full time and handle their complex medical needs. Frank and Tracy had been placed with Steve and Roger within a month of each other, and a baby girl named Ginger was close behind. A couple of years later, nine-week-old Bert was placed with the family.

The family lived in Miami for several years, taking full advantage of the warm weather and thriving cultural center. While the kids had some developmental delays as a result of their health, they did well in school and developed into happy, well-adjusted children. Three years ago, to be closer to Steve's elderly parents, the family moved to Portland, Oregon, and the kids stayed under the laws and supervision of Florida under a standard relocation agreement.

As they were getting settled into a new home and new schools, the kids' new pediatrician told a state caseworker what good parents Steve and Roger were and how well the kids were doing. The caseworker asked Steve and Roger to take in Wayne and Ernie, two kids with HIV from difficult backgrounds. And so the family grew by two.

The family has seen its share of tough times. Ginger, then 6, died of AIDS complications in 1995. All of the children were old enough to understand—and to be devastated.

Steve and Roger are regularly reminded that Florida's law banning gay adoption puts their family in jeopardy. Every few weeks, a letter comes from the state, giving an update on the status of finding another family to adopt Bert. Because he no longer tests positive for HIV and is under the age of 14, Bert is deemed "adoptable." Steve and Roger are legally prohibited from adopting him because of Florida's ban. So the state continues its effort to find him another home, even though this is the only family he's ever known—even though, like all five of the kids, he's already home.

LC- if you have serious concerns about a couple's ability to be good parents, that is one thing. But when there are so many unwanted kids out there, I don't think we can afford to be picky. (not that sexual orientation is anything I personally find to be a reason to be picky.)

The website above chronicles this family's legal struggle in Florida, and lets you know how you can help.

Ok, I got out some anger and I'm back. Thank you, Krelli. I didn't have the balls to say it. Thank you, WonderRandy. I too am proud to be part of this community that supports personal integrity and diversity. There is nothing diverse about close-minded ignorance. There is no integrity in judging someone based on their gender. Thank you, all VB'ers. We debate each other with open minds, intelligence, love, and respect. Goodness, I am so happy to be me right now.

Ooohh, another gay veggie. I've never meet one online or in real life... so wassup WonderRandy? :tame:

Well you guys dotn have to be so rude to me. I dont have anything against them I dont even talk to them. im not even allowed to be in the gay chat rooms or to be around them at all.

lol...

Apple, you're right, gay vegetarians are hard to come by.... It's bad enough that we only have 10 percent of the population to choose from, but when you add the fact that so very few of them are veggie... you end up making a couple compromises... and you make them brush their teeth before you kiss them...

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Well you guys dotn have to be so rude to me. I dont have anything against them I dont even talk to them. im not even allowed to be in the gay chat rooms or to be around them at all.

"I don't even talk to them"... that says a lot. :rolleyes:

as for being rude, you'll find that this little community here is rarely rude, but they do rise up quickly in the face of ignorance. And you, my friend, have demonstrated extreme ignorance today. I don't know you, I'm sure you're a great person with an open mind. Do us a favor. Listen for a bit. do some reading on the subject. open your mind a little more...

Originally posted by Poesía
http://www.mediawatchers.nl/smileys/boksen.gif

here I am eating brown rice and watching round one and all of a sudden I come across this, start laughing, and almost choke to death...

Wait..

Gotta pick myself off of the floor....

here's the American Pschological Association's report on Gay Parenting...

http://www.apa.org/pi/parent.html

summary: it don't matter if you're gay, straight, or bent... :D

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Well you guys dotn have to be so rude to me. I dont have anything against them I dont even talk to them. im not even allowed to be in the gay chat rooms or to be around them at all.

Where did you get these views? Your parents? Maybe this rudeness is the best thing that ever happened to you. Maybe your eyes will be opened. It's interesting that you even started this thread and posed the question. It tells me that maybe there's a part of you inside that knows there has to be another way of seeing things in a less close-minded way. What a shame for you to go through life with such stunted thoughts brought on by adults not allowing you to be around "them." What trailer-trash crap. Now's your chance. Open your eyes and your heart. You'll miss so much wonderfulness in the world if you don't.

Originally posted by luckiecharms
Well you guys dotn have to be so rude to me. I dont have anything against them I dont even talk to them. im not even allowed to be in the gay chat rooms or to be around them at all.
I am going to assume that you come from a family, or a community or whatnot in which many people hold narrow views of homosexuals, and that this seems normal to you. (you are not "allowed" to be around gays and lesbians?)

So let me explain my view, which is what I think most people here feel, too. People are complex. People are more than just a race, sexual orientation, religion, etc. People need to be judged as individuals. The only necessary quality for someone to be homosexual is that he or she be attracted their own sex. Nothing more. Gays and lesbians come in all political affiliations, are vegetarian, meat eaters, black, hispanic, white, intelligent, not so intelligent, you name it.

You said you "don't even talk to them". Well, two people on this board already said they are gay. Saying "them" sound like you are ignoring them bc they are aliens or something. You talk to gays and lesbians all the time. You just don't know it. Because they have much more to their lives than their sexuality, so there is no reason for them to walk up to you and say, "Hi, I'm gay." People have more depth to them than who they sleep with.

You'll miss so much wonderfulness in the world if you don't.

like ME!!!
:D

Good God, I love you people. You are so well-spoken and intelligent. Love, love, love.