I was just wondering if you guys had found the same thing. Before I was a vegetarian I always saw that vegetarianism was a minority and that I never understood why vegetarians ate like that. Now I am one I see meat eaters exactly the same way. I have no idea how anyone can eat meat especially red meat. I see their eating habits as strange and inhuman to society.

This is more confirmed for me because I've been reading some of your topics, and realising there is alot of like minded people out there and that being a vegetarian is the most considerate way to treat all other species in our world :)

Yep, I hear you...

But this is human nature... We veg*ns do things too that are stupid and strange (and rightly so) in the eyes of others.

For instance, our fear of death (very common in the Western world) is completely irrational and strange to buddhists. Some people drink coffee in the morning to wake up and take other drugs in the evening to be able to sleep. Etc. etc.

Meat eating is "special" because it is not harmless to others - it causes a lot of suffering. What we can and should do is to educate.

People engage in all kinds of stupid activities if they are taught that it is OK at a young age.

Yep, sorta like people that continue to smoke.

Yep, sorta like people that continue to smoke.

I smoke but I don't remember ever being told it was ok.

In fact, the fact that it WASN'T deemed to be ok is probably why it seemed cool to start.

I wasn't meaning that people tell others it's ok to smoke.

I probably should have been clearer. I changed her sentence from the first post a little to clarify: "I have no idea how anyone can continue to smoke knowing how it effects the environment and especially how they test it's effects on animals. I see smoking habits as strange and inhuman to society".

I actually find it harder to understand how people motivated by animal rights can continue to smoke (but that's another thread).

"that being a vegan is the most considerate way to treat all other species in our world"

Continuing to smoke is right up there with the stupidest activity I've ever seen.

I try to remember that I was a meat-eater once when I talk to other meat-eaters. It can be easy to turn into one of "those self-righteous vegetarians" otherwise...

Instead, it's easier to put myself in the other person's shoes, which is ultimately more effective in arguing the case for veg*nism.

Hooooo boy... yes, I find myself sometimes looking down my nose at omnivores, but since I´ve been there, too, I have no cause for that. For me, it´s very similar to how I view non-Christians. I was a non-Christian at one point, and though I believe I have found the right way, lording that over those who believe otherwise will help nothing.

Feelings toward non-vegetarians? Since most of my family and many of my friends are non-vegetarians -- love, caring, understanding, acceptance -- and puzzlement, sadness, or impatience.

I see their eating habits as their choice. I would rather they didn't eat meat, but I can't live their lives for them. It makes me sad, but I know that people have to make up their own minds.

Like you, sometimes I see meat-eating as strange. I don't understand why someone would want to eat a corpse. As Thanksgiving approaches and I see more and more turkeys in magazines and on TV, I cringe, seeing a tortured dead bird where meat-eaters see food.

But on the other hand, like epski, I try to remember that I was once a meat-eater, too. I can look back on my own experience and see it from their point of view. This approach really helps when I'm talking to someone about vegetarianism. When they say, "Oh, I could never give up my (fill in the blank)! It would just be too hard," my response can be, "I used to think that, too. I thought it would be difficult, but instead it was really easy. It's the best decision I ever made."

For me, it´s very similar to how I view non-Christians. I was a non-Christian at one point, and though I believe I have found the right way, lording that over those who believe otherwise will help nothing.

Yes, this is something that works in the exact opposite point of view, too, having been a practicing Christian and then coming to the conclusion that there is no God, personally. Good example of why we all need to be more tolerant and respectful of one another's beliefs.

:up: Epski.

Thanks everyone :)
What you said borealis really helped me see things from a wider point of view, as did some of the other ones here. I sat eating dinner with my parents last night whilst they ate burger with mince patties and bacon, and I almost couldn't stand it, but all your posts have helped, thanks again! :juggle: :yes:

Sometimes I feel conflicted...meat-eating does not make a person "bad," and at the same time it is something that causes so much suffering as the status quo just because it "tastes good." I was raised as a vegetarian, and I don't know what chicken, beef, pork or fish tastes like. I can't imagine actually putting something in my mouth that lived and breathed, but most people are reconciled with the fact that the steak on their plate once had a living identity. My feelings about this are very strong, but I was also raised to believe this--that it is a transgression against life. It's hard sometimes to have this extra set of values when most people around you don't give it a thought. I don't think too much about what my friends eat, but meat in the house bothers me. And, it's hard not to hold your significant others to a higher standard than your friends.

Feelings toward non-vegetarians? Since most of my family and many of my friends are non-vegetarians -- love, caring, understanding, acceptance -- and puzzlement, sadness, or impatience.

I see their eating habits as their choice. I would rather they didn't eat meat, but I can't live their lives for them. It makes me sad, but I know that people have to make up their own minds.

Like you, sometimes I see meat-eating as strange. I don't understand why someone would want to eat a corpse. As Thanksgiving approaches and I see more and more turkeys in magazines and on TV, I cringe, seeing a tortured dead bird where meat-eaters see food.

But on the other hand, like epski, I try to remember that I was once a meat-eater, too. I can look back on my own experience and see it from their point of view. This approach really helps when I'm talking to someone about vegetarianism. When they say, "Oh, I could never give up my (fill in the blank)! It would just be too hard," my response can be, "I used to think that, too. I thought it would be difficult, but instead it was really easy. It's the best decision I ever made."

:up: You've described how I feel about it perfectly.

I try to forget that I was a lowly, unevolved, neanderthal meat eater at one time. :D

I don't have a problem with them as long as they don't try to ridicule me or my Unribs. Don't come at me with that unless you want me to point out how gross your rotting flesh dinner is. That in and of itself makes me look down upon certain meat eaters. Luckily I love my husband.

I have found myself talking to meat-eaters about certain foods being bad, referring to the meat in them, and actually (get ready for this one, lacto-ovos, but don't be mad at me), I recently have started to refer to items with eggs and dairy in them as "bad." I don't mean that the foods are bad. I mean bad in a sense that I will not eat it, if that makes any sense.

Let's face it. We all have succumbed to vegetarian snobbiness at some point, and while well-founded, we need to keep it in control. I'm trying to watch what I say in front of omnis. Of course I speak freely here.

I try to live my life by the “live and let live” philosophy. It doesn’t mean I don’t try and change the world, but it means I do it without forcing people to change to my values.

I don’t mind going out with my omni friends and them eating meat/dairy. They know how I feel about it and respect my feelings. They show this respect by not telling me I need dairy to live, or ridiculing me for not getting enough protein. I show my respect for their choice by not hounding them about the environmental impacts of eating meat.

As for my feelings of non-veg*n’s in general…well, I haven’t met them all so I couldn’t tell you.

Continuing to smoke is right up there with the stupidest activity I've ever seen.

You're right, and I appreciate that.

I also know that it's recognised as being one of the most difficult habits to break - and believe me, I've tried (and will keep trying). I assume you've never smoked (because an ex-smoker would realise how hard it is to stop regardless of motivations), I wish I hadn't started either.

Don't assume honey. I smoked for 22 years (started when I was 13). I quit in November of 2002. It's easy once you decide to actually do it. It actually took me either 6 or 7 tries before I actually was successful. I finally figured out the key. It's a mental thing...and it's the hardest to get through. That's why you must first get your mindset right before you try and quit. People that have a hard time quiting haven't fully decided that they want to quit or truly believe they can't for whatever reason. Please read this. (http://www.smokinganimals.com/facts.html). Maybe it will help you motivate yourself into quitting. And check out some sites with pics of mouth, throat, and lung cancer. The mouth and throat are the most common. Those pics are really not pretty. Don't look if it's close to lunchtime. I hope you find the motivation to quit. *fingers crossed*

Sorry for hijacking your thread Nicky.

aha, a reformed smoker - aren't they always the worst! J/k! I was one for 3 years, when I managed to give up for that amount of time. I just couldn't understand why others couldn't give up too. Stupidly (yep, even more stupidly than when I first started) I began again. Hope you have more willpower than me and manage to keep it up, good for you. You're right that it's a mental mindset. Just need to get my head in "that place" again.

p.s. careful, if I were a vegan I could've been offended by the "honey" !!!!!!

I finally figured out the key. It's a mental thing...and it's the hardest to get through. That's why you must first get your mindset right before you try and quit. People that have a hard time quiting haven't fully decided that they want to quit or truly believe they can't for whatever reason.

just to add to this. My MIL (a long-time smoker who had tried many times to quit) found her 'key' when she considered buying nicotine patches. She was so offended that her more of her money would be going to the cigarette companies (who made the cigarettes in the first place) that she resolved to prove to herself she could do it without them. She did it too--it has to be at least three years now. :up:

i really wish all u vegan gals out there would start dating us vegan guys!

Yes, this is something that works in the exact opposite point of view, too, having been a practicing Christian and then coming to the conclusion that there is no God, personally. Good example of why we all need to be more tolerant and respectful of one another's beliefs.


This describes me too :)


As for the original subject of the thread ;)

I've been struggling through this too. I'm naturally very peaceful, loving, accepting. However, when I became vegan I became very hateful towards anyone who carried on doing the things I found so repulsive. Unfortunately this hate was increased by a debate on the subject I had on a different site with a group of omnis (before I came to VB). I ended up hating everyone there, and I regret some of the things I said.

On a side note: I went back to that site recently to 'draw a line' under that chapter of my life and maybe make some personal and general apologies. However, the thread was locked so the opportunity was taken away. :stinkeye: Heh, dk_art will know what I'm talking about here since he was also present in that debate, and I probably ruined his wonderful, controlled and sensible arguements by reducing myself (and thus the impression of vegans) to the level of the antagonising omnis.

You know what, I'm almost crying thinking about that experience. It messed me up. I've never felt so much anger, hurt and hate as I felt during that debate. If I could change anything it would be that I'd found VB and settled into my veganism before I started that thread (which was never meant to be a debate in the first place). Urrgh. I feel sh*tty now.

Thanks to VB I'm more peaceful about the whole thing, and am even finding a sense of humour about it. I even went so far the other day as to say I respected someone's decision to eat meat. I'm not sure yet if I meant it, and saying it was harder than I could describe, but I said it, which is a start.

I hope I'll get my feelings on the matter sorted out soon. I don't want to feel this hate, but at the same time I'm scared that if I lose it I'll not as passionate anymore. I can't seem to find a balance between tolerance and belief.

lol, Nicky, you've really set me off now.

someone give me a hug?

:hug: One love: Unconditionally. Big goal, yet obtainable. :)

peace