Hi everyone, I hope I make sense, but it's awfully late at night and I can't sleep!

Does anyone have some words of wisdom for me? I am a step-mom to a 13 year old girl. We get a long pretty good - except for me being vegan.
She lived with us this summer for 6 weeks. She went back home to her mom - and lots of abuse. Years of abuse. My husband is driving to Arkansas (from Minnesota) as week speak to pick her up and bring her here to our house to live with us indefinitley.

I am so excited and relieved for this poor girl. She has endured so much with her home situation. Amazingly, she has turned out pretty good but I know she will be going to therapy for years ahead.

I think it's going to be quite a change of pace for me...I am just 26, and to have a 13 year old step-daughter blows my mind. It seems like just yesterday I was 13 and raising all kinds of trouble.

My main reason for posting this is to ask your opinion about how to deal with the whole vegan/veggie thing with her.

She is not vegan nor is she vegetarian. But the rules at my house are "no animal products" (unless it's for our cat). Do I bend the rules for her? Do I break down and start buying organic cheese and yogurt for her (and refined flour & sugar)? I think she's okay with no meat, but I know she loves dairy. Part of the reason why I don't want these things in our house is because I cannot see spending my $$ on something I am totally against. Also, I know that if I have these things in my house, this will be a temptation for our toddler son - which I will absolutely not allow!
When she stayed with us for 6 weeks this past summer, she made a big deal out of not being able to eat whatever the heck she wanted to for the first couple weeks, and then she was fine with it after that. I think it was more of a power struggle more than anything.
I am a vegan, my son is vegan, and my husband eats vegan food in our house, but outside of our house he eats whatever he wants.
Anyway, I could use some input! I have to get to bed....thanks for hearing me out... :dizzy:

Hmm.. That's a really tough situation! No matter what happens, I wish you the best of luck.

I'm thinking, that as a 13 year old with a new step mom, she's probably going to be pretty uneasy in the situation herself and is going to look for any reason to like or dislike you. If you force her to eat vegan, she's probably not going to like it, and it could be bad for you in the long run - lots of power struggles, arguments, teenage tempers. She is old enough so that she probably thinks she can make all of her own decisions, so forcing her into a diet, even if it's at the house, would make it easy for her to rebel against you ... I'm starting to repeat stuff here.

Essentially, I think that what you need to do is to sit her down and talk to her. As I said, she wants to make her own decisions, so if you talk to her and let her have some say she'll probably go along with it, and maybe even respect you some for it.

Setting: Girl's new bedroom
Cast: SallyK, Girl

Sallyk: Hi girl, I know that you're not vegan, and that's fine with me. I do want you to understand that this household up until this point was vegan, and both I and my son are vegan. I don't want to pressure you into being vegan yourself, and you have every right to eat whatever you choose outside of this house, but while you're in the house, I'd like it if you'd eat vegan as well.

Girl: I think that sucks. I love cheese sooo much.

SallyK: That's fine, you can love cheese, and you can eat it outside the house. I think that if you brought cheese into the house it would be difficult for my son because he may want to have some too, and I don't want him to have any. How do you think we could compromise on this?

Dunno... maybe this helps a bit?

Dialogue, talking, explaining - I think this ought to go a long way. Let's see what other people have to say. :)

SallyK - welcome to the world of teenagers! :)

I have a similar situation. I am vegetarian (pretty darned strict one - but not vegan). My daugther is omni (committed to the "cause").

Here is my house rule: I won't prepare meat or dairy -or have it in the fridge with one exception. I will buy her frozen prepared meals within reason (ie a couple of meals per week). Things like Marie Callendars, Lean Cuisine, etc. etc. etc. This was my comprimise (sp). She prefers home cooked food, so she eats a frozen entree only once or twice a week (if that).

I don't dwell on the "can't have" thing though. I've found veggie things she enjoys, and I am always on the lookout for things she and I can enjoy together. I often make two meals (both vegetarian) as she won't eat tofu or tempeh or anything she considers "weird". If I want a tofu meal I'll make her a veggie stir-fry or macaroni and "not cheese" or something else. Kind of a pain, but I"m not going to force her to eat something she hates.

I don't force my values down her throat, but I do try really hard to make vegetarian foods attractive to her.

So far it's working out.
She can eat whatever she wants outside of the house though (and does....sigh)

I agree with Mikie. Give her all the facts (as much as you think she can handle). Then take her grocery shopping with you. Maybe give her $10-$20 and tell her she can buy whatever she wants with it. Trust that you've gotten through to her. If you haven't, that's ok. It may take time. So she may buy some lunchmeat or hotdogs or whatever. Change is hard for an adult; even harder for a child. But by giving her money to make her own decisions on what she will eat not only shows that you trust her, but also puts the ball in her court for the responsibilty or her choices. Try it...couldn't hurt really. Please let us know how it turns out.

always be authentic. always be clear in your explainations. never, ever talk down to her like she's a baby.

teens are highly intuitive. they know fear and will capitolize on it. they know when you're bs-ing, they know when you're not explaining things fully, and they know when you're not being yourself. They will not trust you for it, and they will rebel against it.

i work with teens in my yoga classes. it's true that i'm getting some of the best case scenarios in class. but, i've also worked with some of the "worst"--the main problem is that mom (or step mom) kept babying them. I would talk to them like they were any other student (aged 40 or so), and they would respond to that. In time, they started to trust, chill out, and even treat their mom's better. (of course, simultaneously, i would often tell the moms to stop talking to her like she was 6. when they got that down, the teen started to trust her too.)

So, even with this decision--about not bringing animal products into the house--you can be completely honest with her about the process that you go through, how you came to this decision, and have your husband (her father) talk about why he supports this idea (as an omni). Likewise, you may want to give her a "food allowance"--for eating out with friends, or at school, or picking up something special (like those frozen dinners--to be eaten that evening). Also, it would probably be a good idea to set up a weekly "father-daughter" dinner where the two of them go out and eat whatever they want--meat, cheese, otherwise. It's also good for father-daughter bonding. I agree with the idea of cooking together and finding recipes that she loves. That will be great!

It's going to work out for you--no problem! Just be yourself!

But, if your house is vegan, i would keep it that way.

Sallyk, I think that I would allow her to have an adjustment period...say 3 - 6 months, not saying anything about "no meat" I would just fix the vegan food that you normally do - especially the foods that are as close to "normal" as possible. Go easy on the weird ones, like hummus and falafel and heavy on vegan pasta, burgers, fries etc.

I would wait until she trusts you and is used to your vegan food before instituting any meat rules. Then I would give lots of notice.

A lot later, I would allow her to eat meat and cheese outside of your home only, but I would pay for it. Give her money for burger king etc.

Lastly, I would stop paying for any meat or dairy for her (but only after she was old enough to get a job and again, with advanced notice.) Hopefully she will be a vegan by then though...:)

Good luck.

I really like what Zoebird said (as usual. :smitten: )

I think it would be a good idea to keep your house vegan, since it is your house. I think that you need to show her that you trust her and don't want to command her life though, and that's why I really like the food allowance. $10-20 a week that she's allowed to use however she wants outside of the house.

Make sure you explain everything to her though, let her know why you made the decisions you do.

All these replies were helpful I think. :D

My main reason for posting this is to ask your opinion about how to deal with the whole vegan/veggie thing with her.

She is not vegan nor is she vegetarian. But the rules at my house are "no animal products" (unless it's for our cat). Do I bend the rules for her? Do I break down and start buying organic cheese and yogurt for her (and refined flour & sugar)? I think she's okay with no meat, but I know she loves dairy. Part of the reason why I don't want these things in our house is because I cannot see spending my $$ on something I am totally against. Also, I know that if I have these things in my house, this will be a temptation for our toddler son - which I will absolutely not allow!
When she stayed with us for 6 weeks this past summer, she made a big deal out of not being able to eat whatever the heck she wanted to for the first couple weeks, and then she was fine with it after that. I think it was more of a power struggle more than anything.


You want a recipe for disaster, then here it is: combine a 13-year-old in a new setting, a half-sibling, and rules outside of the mainstream. Then mix in a stepmother, and voila...fractured marriage.

A couple fo things in your post stood out. There is no "my house", there is now an "our house", that includes your daughter. No "my money", there is "our money". Another? Restricting the actions of a teen because of the temptations of a toddler half-sibling.

You classify it as a power struggle, yet this girl maybe really just wants to eat what she likes. Is that so unreasonable?

This doesn't mean you should have to cook or fix anything for her that you object to - that can be the responsibility of her and her father.

I have to agree with Tame. Well perhaps I wouldn't have put it like he did, Tame is an original... :)

Anyway you really should think of it as "our house, our money, our decisions", etc etc. I understand not having meat in your house which is fine but at the same time let her know that she's can eat what she wants outside of the house. It's also a good time for her to bond with her dad. Also explain to your stepdaughter that the baby cannot have meat, cheese, etc and that if there ever comes a time that she does bring something into the house that he cannot have any. As a stepdaughter I just want to stress that you be honest with the girl and have no fear. :D I'm sure you'll get along fine in no time.

Oops, I guess when I was so tired the other night when I posted this, I forgot to mention that she is allowed to eat whatever she wants outside of home. That's a rule we've always had for her and her dad.
She is registering for school today and she asked my husband and I "can I eat whatever at school?" We told her yes and she was fine with that.
At dinner last night she tried Yves Veggie Chick'n burger sliced on her salad, she said she liked it! Which is great because when she was here this summer she wouldn't touch any meat analogs at all.
All is well here so far. I think Tame was completely over-analyzing the situation. She and I get along very well. I adore her and she adores me! (At least for now!) She is very happy to be in a home where she's not getting beat up every day. We also don't call our son her half-brother. They are brother and sister. Mentioning the "half" part makes us all cringe. It almost makes it sound like their relationship is insignificant, when in fact, they love eachother just as much as any other siblings...if not more because previously they didnt' see eachother often.
My main question was whether or not to allow dairy in the house now, and most of you seemed to think that "no" was the way to go. I do like dvmarie's approach though. It sounds like that works well for her...we may do that too if needed.
She will be in school - probably eating school lunch (yikes - irradiated meat and pretty much devoid of nutrition) so her meals at home will be breakfast (which she loves Puffins & any other Barbara's cereal, waffles, my special vegan pancakes, etc) and dinner which she has already said she wanted to choose a recipe out of one of my cookbooks and she can prepare it for the family once per week with my help. I like the idea of her eating out with her dad - but I haven't mentioned that yet. He is only home for dinner 3 nights a week (or less)...I don't know if I want to cut that down to only 1 or 2 nights a week! My son and I would miss him terribly!
Anyway, thanks for the advice. I appreciate it!

Yeah, tell yourself I over analyze.

Sorry, but when everything is "yours", what is "theirs"?

Gee, instead of you making the rules for her, maybe her father should have some say? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't have a house or money.

Icky...I have a half-brother and I have never referred to him as my "half". It makes me cringe as well. I :whack: people who tell him he's my half-brother. It's good you guys seem to get along and it seems like she's trying your recipes so that's great! :hamster:

Icky...I have a half-brother and I have never referred to him as my "half". It makes me cringe as well. I :whack: people who tell him he's my half-brother.

First of all, he is your half-brother. The term is correct. Some may choose to never use it, and most people I know don't use it in casual references, but it is the proper term.

My sons are half-brothers. They do not share the same biological father.

Since your husband isn't available for dinner but just a few nights a week, maybe they could have a monthly dinner together? Something very special, but never missed...

I think the frozen dinner idea is good, too...

Yeah, tell yourself I over analyze.

Sorry, but when everything is "yours", what is "theirs"?

Gee, instead of you making the rules for her, maybe her father should have some say? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't have a house or money.

Wow, someone seems a little bitter!

Let me explain myself here...It was nearly 3:00 a.m when I posted that message...I was tired and had a few martinis that night. I apologize if the verbiage isn't exactly up to your standards.


Let me also add that I have my political passions and I do have money to support them. My husband and I have made the joint decision to raise our son as a vegan. I made the decision that I wanted a meat-free house. He supports me 100%. He has his own things that he wants for his children, and if he is passionate about something and says "I don't want that in *my* house", this is certainly not going to offend me the way that it has you, Tame. This is just who we are and how we talk. I am sorry that you are lead to believe that it signals something disfunctional. If you were a fly on the wall here, you would understand, but you are not. The internet doesn't always get the point across quite the way you want it to, and people twist and over-analyize things all the time. Having a couple martinis at 2 am before trying to talk about something serious doesn't exactly help either. So sue me!

Zoebird had excellent suggestions. I think that it's important that you maintain the food rules of your home. You are still the adult and are able to and should set boundaries/rules. You'll have to adjust just as much as she will and I don't think it's necessary to chuck all of your ideals and needs to the wind in an attempt to be accomodating. I'm sure there are other areas of your shared lives that will be and can be negotiable.

As long as she's aware and allowed to eat what she would like away from home, I don't think it's unreasonable for you to insist that animal products not be introduced into your shared home.

Whatever. Justify it however you want and however it makes you feel better. Obviously you wanted a certain answer, and you got it. Of course, at least two of the people advising you have no children, and I don't believe anyone is a stepparent. But that's okay - everyone said you should set your rules and make everyone else abide by them.

How nice that you will "let" her eat what she likes outside of the home.

What's funny is just about everyone here would be coming up with creative ideas to help a veg*n child adjust to a new household, but those evil omni kids have got to learn what is what, huh?

Whatever. Justify it however you want and however it makes you feel better. Obviously you wanted a certain answer, and you got it. Of course, at least two of the people advising you have no children, and I don't believe anyone is a stepparent. But that's okay - everyone said you should set your rules and make everyone else abide by them.

How nice that you will "let" her eat what she likes outside of the home.

What's funny is just about everyone here would be coming up with creative ideas to help a veg*n child adjust to a new household, but those evil omni kids have got to learn what is what, huh?

Tame, I am niether a parent nor a step-parent, so I'm not gonna be offering SallyK advice here. But I did want to say I distinctly remember being told at 13 "This is my house, these are my rules. Deal with it, kid". I've said the exact same thing myself to grown flatmates, "my name is on the lease, my rules apply, so deal". So don't jump down her throat for wanting to have some rules and guildlines in her house. Seems perfectly natural to me.

I would agree, if this were her biological child. My wife and I use the "our house, our rules" line constantly, but we are in complete agreement. When step-parents start the "my" business, over time it can damage the relationship and cause friction with the spouse.

I read SallyK's post in another thread about her husband, and she stated most likely he agreed to the "meat free" house because it is no big deal to him - he eats only 3 meals or so a week in the house. It is a bigger deal to his daughter, and I am serious when I say issues like this can grow into bigger problems.

But hey, the non-parents said it will be okay, so it must be so.

Okay, Tame...YOU go ahead and raise YOUR omni kids & step kids however you want. (assuming you have children & step children judging by your last post) I'm not going to stop you. Next time I see your name pop up in a parenting thread, I will remember that YOU obviously choose to raise YOUR children differently than I want to raise MINE.
(or should I say, YOU obviously choose to raise YOUR children differently than WE want to raise OURS..blaaaaaahhh technical technical)
I wasn't looking for a particular answer. (note, how I liked dvmarie's approach to allow certian frozen meals in the home regardless of the dairy content, I also liked that some people said don't change the rules in the house). However, there are some answers that I knew I didn't want...ie, "let" her eat whatever the heck she wants whenever the heck she wants it.
I don't know who all has children on this message board, and I don't know who is a step-parent, but I do welcome advice from everyone who has constructive ideas.

At the risk of facing the wrath of Tame - I think he is thinking a little negative.

I wouln't go into it looking at worst case scenerio (and it doesn't look like you are). Also - with teenagers (speaking from experience since I have one *s*), they respond to the general atmosphere around them. Happy, upbeat, positive, etc. - they respond.

Vegetarian food is great - Veggie Lifestyle is great - you live this and your enthusiasn will rub off. Plus - you're so COOL SallyK....how can anyone resist your influence?? :)

p.s - it's all a learning experience BELIEVE ME!! - I don't just have plans A and B (I have C and D and E and F too) ;)

I think you're doing a great job, Sally. :smitten:

I think you're doing a great job, Sally. :smitten:


:yes: What he said! :D

I'll ring in here, as I'm the stepmother to a 13-year-old boy. I've been a stepmother for almost 6 years; I've been through the fire and am just now coming out on the other side, a lot wiser.

Tame, I'm going to disagree with you on one point. While the technical terms "half" and "step" are correct with regard to siblings, I've seen too often where it creates more divisiveness between kids (who are already torn in several directions already). When my husband and I have kids, we will refer to them as my stepson's brother or sister. The term "half" lessens what I hope will be strong relationships between them. I will caveat the above with one big exception - I do not refer to my stepson as "my son," because I believe that is disrespectful to his mother. I introduce him as my stepson, and he refers to me as his stepmother - there's no animosity there, it's what we agreed to.

Okay, now for Sally. I think you're going into this with a great attitude. Welcoming a teenager into your home full-time is a huge adjustment, so you are to be commended for your positive attitude and willingness to support your husband in raising his child. But...(and I know you know there's a "but")...please go into this with realistic expectations of your role. The bottom line is that this is not your child. Yes, she will be living with you. Yes, you will be very involved in her life. That doesn't make you her primary parent. She is your husband's child, and he has every right to say, "Sally, I support your being vegan, and raising our son together vegan, but this is my daughter who, like me, is an omni. I'm not going to ask you to purchase or prepare non-vegan food for her, but I am going to purchase non-vegan food for her sometimes, and eat it with her in this house." He may not say that, but he has every right to - this is his house and his money, too, and definitely his child.

When my stepson is in my home I have to let a lot of things go. He is not being raised the way I would necessarily raise my own child, but guess what? Tough noogies on me. I'm certainly not a doormat, but I set my boundaries (no being disrespectful to me, I am not his personal maid and cook, etc.), and leave it at that. I've been a stepmom long enough to come up with my credo: I am a tertiary figure in his life. I support him as much as possible, I set my boundaries, I offer my opinion only when I am asked for it, and other than that I keep my mouth shut. My stepson has two involved parents who are totally responsible for the way he turns out, good or bad. This doesn't mean I don't love him, or want the best in life for him. It DOES mean that my husband, his father, is primarily responsible for him when he's in our home. My husband makes the decisions about what he eats, what he wears, what time he goes to bed, how much TV he's allowed to watch, how long he can stay on instant message with his little girlfriends, and, when necessary, dispenses discipline.

Why don't I do these things? Because it takes YEARS to build the kind of trust necessary to "parent" a child. When I first was together with his Dad, he was 8 years old, and we had a hell of a time. I jumped right in - "mothering" the heck out of him. You can guess where that got me - a stepson screaming "you're not my mother" at me all the time and my husband constantly running interference. Thank God he was only 8 - he was still young and sweet enough that we both got over it, and have bonded enough now that he's a moody teenager. Make no mistake about it - children's loyalties are with their biological parents. This girl's mother may be the biggest piece of garbage to ever live, but your stepdaughter loves her and always will. She may be excited about coming to live with you, and then 3 months from now be totally resentful of you. Why? Because you're being the mother she wishes her real mother would be. Please let your husband step up and be her parent during the rocky adjustment period when she first arrives. Please tell him that he's going to have to cut back on his work hours and be home more often. Please let him know that, if he wants HIS daughter to live with him, that HE has to step up to the plate - and that means not assuming that you'll do everything for her.

Trying to love and raise children who are not your own is a supremely difficult and, many times, totally thankless job. I pour my heart into my stepson. But I sit alone on Mother's Day. Never forget that. You will hopefully have many good times with your stepdaughter, and weather many storms. Just don't be too controlling - it can only blow up in your face. You have such a big heart (obviously) - I think this is going to be a great thing for your stepdaughter. Just be careful - both with her feelings, and your own.

Firebird - I don't use the term "half"-sibling in casual conversation, but when talking to someone about a parenting issue, I do think it is a reasonable term.

Otherwise, I completely agree with your advice to SallyK. I adopted Tame, Jr., so he technically is not a stepson. He is now my son, but I learned some early lessons about building that trust, and understanding my role as a new authority figure in his life. Years later, it's all good now, and he wouldn't dream of telling me I'm not his father, and I only think of him as my boy. (I'm amazed at the number of people who think we look alike.)

SallyK - say whatever you want, but I do perceive your tone as controlling. All I can base my views on are your opinions on a message board, and perhaps they are offbase. But...
You won't allow your stepdaughter to have dairy...so your son won't eat it.
You said in another thread you won't allow your husband to have dairy...so you won't eat it.

Sorry, paint it how you like, but when you post about "letting" someone do something that really should be outside your control, you come across as controlling.
The father of this girl should have the ultimate say. That is not to say that you and he can't work out a reasonable agreement, but I can tell you from personal experience, as well as second hand, that stepparents that start setting strict rules often lead to big problems.

And yes, my kids are omni, as well as my wife. If you think my advice is somehow diet related, you aren't thinking critically.

Imagine that a stepchild is brought into a home with a stepparent with strong religious convictions, very different from that of the child. How many of you would find it reasonable that the child be forced to attend religious services, prayer meetings, or engage in daily prayer sessions, because that is what the stepparent wants? When questioned why the child should be forced to particpate, the answer is that it is to protect the half-sibling. The father doesn't seem to care one way or the other, because he isn't around and doesn't have to participate often.

All of you, every last one, would be screaming bloody murder about how unfair this situation would be to the child.

Guess what? This is the same thing, but as usual, the fundamentalist vegans on this board can't see it.