Cat food issue

[Virpukka]

I just stopped watching Earthlings and I would like to stop buying meat to this household at all. Well that is not possible because I have two cats and thought I have read from some people turning their cats to vegan I don't believe that it would be safe to them in any way. But I also hate to support those big companies who sell food what is done fro crap. Well that is cheap way to throw meal front of my cats and easy because they like that food but I want them to eat healthy food and in same time cause as little suffering to other animals as possible. I really don't know what to do specially when all the organics foods are super expensive in here and they have just couple labels what they sell those in here. And one thing with those organics foods are that they sell them only with one serving packages and because I have two cats it would mean that I would need 4 of those in one day and let me tell that it would be extremely expensive. I really have big dilemma now with this because I really want to change what they eat.

[Alicia Avocado]

Good question....Cats are carnivores, they are not herbivorous in nature. So unfortunately we are left having to feed them meat. I think we need to look at the larger issue of factory farms selling meat left overs to cat food companies. So, if we do not want to support that then perhaps finding a local farmer who at least treats his animals well before murdering them is the lesser of two evils?. Unfortunately you would have to prepare the meat, but at least we are not supporting larger industries.

Just an idea.

[cstadt]

The way I think of it is that my kitties eat what they eat and they can't help it :)

I buy them what they need because they're under my care. I know where the meat comes from but they do not... they can't make the decision to change what they eat like we can. I know very well that they love meat/meat treats. If I were to cut that off and make them vegan I'm absolutely sure they would be able to tell. I'd be too afraid that they'd think they were not being fed right/what they want.

[Koala]

I have tried wrapping my head around this issue as I would like to care for some shelter cats in the future, and my conclusion is that there is no good answer to this problem.

You cannot kill your cats or give them food that is harmful to them, and still you don't want to put the life of your cat above the life of the poor animals murdered to feed him/her.

So my semi-good answer is to advocate abolishing keeping cats as pets and neutering and spaying, while feeding your cat with the necessary meat. In addition, even though you may not want to feed an all vegan diet, you can give vegan treats and some vegan food.

[Virpukka]

I know that I can't change them and I don't want to. They are created in the way how they are. I just hope that there would be more humane ways to feed them. The fact is that somebody needs to die to them get food but I really don't want to support that sadistic way of animal treatment what they do in meat industry and because this is such a small country they don't sell so many organic options in here what is a shame. If I could choose that one I would at least know that those animals would have been treated in better way when they lived. One thing what I have tried to do is get my mom to drive me into one organic pig farm where you can see how they keep the animals but she thinks that it takes too much effort and because I don't have drivers license I can't go there by myself. Well maybe I just try to find someone who sells organic meat and start to do my own cat food to them and start really to fight with them with that diet change. So far when I have done the food by myself both of my cats have decided to fast until I give up and go buy that grocery store garbage to them.

[pandora9kry]

Here is a really good program on vegan cats, and after listening to it I would NEVER consider feeding my cat vegan food.
http://www.animalvoices.ca/shows/vegan_pets

Also, Colleen Patric-Goudreau does a good Compassionate Cooks episode about pet food called What Do Vegetarians Feed Their Dogs & Cats?

Personally, I feed my cats half canned, and half kibble. Their canned food is a mixture of 50/50 canned pumpkin and canned meaty cat food, usually with some sort of vegetables already in there. So this cuts down their meat consumption a bit, and their kibble is 35% vegetables and fruit, so that cuts it down again. I find that that's a good balance, and they LOVE their food.

[rosiem]

So my semi-good answer is to advocate abolishing keeping cats as pets and neutering and spaying, while feeding your cat with the necessary meat. In addition, even though you may not want to feed an all vegan diet, you can give vegan treats and some vegan food.

Your kidding me, right?

[Koala]

Your kidding me, right?
Off course not. But I am also for abolishing keeping other animals as well, not just cats. I told you why in the egg thread. It suprises me that you act so suprised everytime you see abolitionist arguments. It is a common opinion for vegans.

[catmando]

Off course not. But I am also for abolishing keeping other animals as well, not just cats. I told you why in the egg thread. It suprises me that you act so suprised everytime you see abolitionist arguments. It is a common opinion for vegans.

Be careful what you wish for. When you start "abolishing" groups of animals or people, things can easily get out of hand. There's a much greater chance of vegans being abolished than there is of cats or dogs. They got the numbers...:afro:

[Koala]

Be careful what you wish for. When you start "abolishing" groups of animals or people, things can easily get out of hand. There's a much greater chance of vegans being abolished than there is of cats or dogs. They got the numbers...:afro:
The only difference is that vegans aren't considered anyone's property, so there are no slave like life to free us from. :pibo:

[catmando]

The only difference is that vegans aren't considered anyone's property, so there are no slave like life to free us from. :pibo:

My cat wanted to answer that, but he's not allowed to post here (he's a pescetarian). He is highly offended that you refer to him as "property." He sleeps 16 hours a day, eats when he wants and is in complete control of our house. Your average vegan, on the other hand, has a soul-crushing job they hate, monster children they have to support for 18 years and more bills than they know what to do with. "No slave like life to free us from." Hold the thought.

[Koala]

My cat wanted to answer that, but he's not allowed to post here (he's a pescetarian). He is highly offended that you refer to him as "property." He sleeps 16 hours a day, eats when he wants and is in complete control of our house. Your average vegan, on the other hand, has a soul-crushing job they hate, monster children they have to support for 18 years and more bills than they know what to do with. "No slave like life to free us from." Hold the thought.
It's not me who consider him property, society is. The point of abolition is to stop this. And I am not against caring for animals who already exist and treat them as family (as I am sure you do), I am against breeding animals into an existence where they depend on humans to care for them. But let's not make the thread about my abolitionist views on animal rights :up:

[catmando]

It's not me who consider him property, society is. The point of abolition is to stop this. And I am not against caring for animals who already exist and treat them as family (as I am sure you do), I am against breeding animals into an existence where they depend on humans to care for them. But let's not make the thread about my abolitionist views on animal rights :up:

Are you also opposed to breeding babies into an existence where they depend on humans to care for them?:baby:

[Koala]

Are you also opposed to breeding babies into an existence where they depend on humans to care for them?:baby:
You really can't see the difference? If you want to explore abolitionism, this (http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/faqs/)is a good place to start. Alternatively you can start a new thread about it.

[catmando]

You really can't see the difference? If you want to explore abolitionism, this (http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/faqs/)is a good place to start. Alternatively you can start a new thread about it.

I wasn't the one who brought up "abolition." I just don't like to be told what's good for me and what to do. Doing what I want is the best way to fight being a slave. Go on and tell people they can't have pets in your future utopia and you'll have the place all to yourself.

[Koala]

I wasn't the one who brought up "abolition." I just don't like to be told what's good for me and what to do. Doing what I want is the best way to fight being a slave. Go on and tell people they can't have pets in your future utopia and you'll have the place all to yourself.
I just gave my thoughts on the topic :) It's not about what is good for you, it's about what is good for the non-human animals. It is also a discussion, not me dictating you what to do. They will not suffer from not being able to give birth to new animals of the species we have created for us. Funny how you seem to be against the view that animals are slaves, but still uses language like: "tell people they can't have pets". I just don't think animals are ours to have.

[catmando]

I just gave my thoughts on the topic :) It's not about what is good for you, it's about what is good for the non-human animals. It is also a discussion, not me dictating you what to do. They will not suffer from not being able to give birth to new animals of the species we have created for us. Funny how you seem to be against the view that animals are slaves, but still uses language like: "tell people they can't have pets". I just don't think animals are ours to have.

"The species we have created for us?" Why don't you tell us all the story of Creation when man created cats? Sorry, but my cat won't let me argue any more, he wants me to get to work.

[Koala]

"The species we have created for us?" Why don't you tell us all the story of Creation when man created cats? Sorry, but my cat won't let me argue any more, he wants me to get to work.
Ever heard of domestication?

[catmando]

Ever heard of domestication?

For me or the cat?

[Koala]

For me or the cat?
Humans domesticating animals, like cats.

[catmando]

Humans domesticating animals, like cats.

Actually, humans have been domesticated longer than any other animal. Hey, how about we abolish us too?

[KirstenKat]

My view is cats as other animals should go their natural instinctive way and be carnivores (or herbivores whichever way the species is meant to be). Humans are much more evolved and imaginative so we are smart enough to find ways to go about life without killing, to have the choice between omni or veg. However I agree it stinks our animals have to eat the leftovers of the animals we tortured. As far as abolishing pets I think we've gone too far to end it. And even though over population and abandonment is a huge problem from domesticating animals, most are happy, loved, and safe with us. And you have to be positive and think of all the people who help save those abandonment animals. No I think pets are a great idea. I've seen the difference between a stray cat and a domesticated one and the domesticated ones are so much happier.

[Koala]

Actually, humans have been domesticated longer than any other animal. Hey, how about we abolish us too?
I'm not sure what you are saying? Humans have not been taken to be bred for specific purposes by another species.


As far as abolishing pets I think we've gone too far to end it. And even though over population and abandonment is a huge problem from domesticating animals, most are happy, loved, and safe with us. And you have to be positive and think of all the people who help save those abandonment animals. No I think pets are a great idea. I've seen the difference between a stray cat and a domesticated one and the domesticated ones are so much happier.
Most are not loved and taken good care of. Most are neglected or abandoned. I help save abandoned animals, I work at a cat shelter and I love cats. Through this I see so much pain and suffering that I can't come to another conclusion that humans should not own and breed "pets" into being property that we can treat how we like. Abolition does not mean putting cats on the street, it means stop breeding them. And stray cats is just another example why we shouldn't have domesticated cats to begin with. Strays are the consequence of people abandoning cats and not caring for them like they should. Stray cats are just domesticated cats that are homeless, they are not two different types of animals.

[pandora9kry]

I find it offensive for someone to say that my cats are "property." They are part of my family and they love me just as much as I love them, and they benefit from our relationship just as much as I do.

Personally I am not opposed to the responsible breeding of animals, but at this point I believe more strongly in adopting animals until the homeless pet population is curbed.

[Alicia Avocado]

The only difference is that vegans aren't considered anyone's property, so there are no slave like life to free us from.

I understand what you mean in terms of animals beng kept. However, my philosophy is that if you set something free and it comes back to you, it's not *yours* but it's a blessing that they want to be family with you. I used to have a bird, but then I realized it wasn't right to keep something in a cage when it is meant to fly, and I will never do that again.

I let my cat out everyday, and he always returns, even after frequently moving and sometimes even moving to wooded areas. He sees me and my boyfriend as part of his pack really, and shos his affections by attempting to groom us (he's quite the hair stylist). He is by no means a slave. Like Catmando said, my cat has a pretty good lifestyle, he chooses when he eats, where he sleeps, when he sleeps etc. Sounds like a lot of freedoms to me.

When it comes to spaying and neutering, I think it is necessary as cats and dogs can easily breed out of balance and if they were to roam free it would upset eco-systems in areas. If we allowed this to happen, I am sure someone would suggest shooting them to keep numbers down, so in reality, preventing the births is the better option as it reduces harm to animals.